Re: believing idols Vs thinking for self

 I did some research and there is a possible mechanism to differentiate orally administered from anally administered caffeine: The hepatic portal system. This series of veins connects the gastrointestinal tract to the liver.

Thanks for discussing this instead of coming back with attacks.  It is so nice discussing these things with a real adult.

``Many drugs that are absorbed through the GI tract are substantially metabolized by the liver before reaching general circulation. This is known as the first pass effect. As a consequence, certain drugs can only be taken via certain routes.''

I don't know how caffeine works. Does it require activation? When and where is it metabolized, and with what efficiency? Is the first step metabolite inactive?

This link explains this:

http://www.energyfiend.com/2010/01/caffeine-metablolism

"As soon as the caffeine enters the body it is metabolized by the liver and broken down into theophylline, theobromine and paraxanthine.

From there these chemicals travel throughout the body where they effect various body functions. "

All three of those compounds are stimulants that still adversely affect the adrenals. Therefore as we can see it does not matter if the caffeine and other alkaloids go from the colon directly through the portal vein to the liver. 

Absorption is actually quite high for the colon. What is funny is that one site talking about Gerson was claiming that the alkaloids in the coffee were stimulating the liver's detoxification system. Then they turn around and claim that the caffeine has no effect on the body because the coffee is not absorbed from the colon.  Apparently they don't realize that the caffeine is one of those alkaloids they are claiming that stimulates the detoxification system.

Something to note is that palmitic acid from coffee is said to have an effect on the liver.

I had not heard that before. An alternative doctor I was working with years ago said it was the caffeine that was stimulating the detox. But I just did a search and yes, the palmitic acid does have an effect by stimulating glutathione S-transferase. Although this was in rats, not humans. So further research is still needed to show this effect in humans. In addition it needs to be shown that palmitic acid is absorbed from the colon. In the studies they used the salts, but palmitic acid is generally found in fats. And fats are emulsified and absorbed in the small intestine, not the colon.

It could be that there is an impact derived from this alone, and that one might even forego the caffeine. Find a different source of palmitic acid.

Again absorption of those sources may be a problem since fats are emulsified and absorbed in the small intestine, not the colon.

Even then, though, this could still be more "button mashing" without a good understanding of the ultimate effects. It seems it has something to do with acetyl-CoA. Could be the caffeine crashing is propped up by metabolic overdriving. Coffee palmitic acid to liver -> acetyl-CoA carboxylase inhibition -> elevated acetyl-CoA -> increased fat metabolism. If this is what's going on, you can expect more ketone bodies. (Advocates! You can get ketone test strips from the local pharmacy! Are your levels elevated?) Things to be careful about, then, would be heightened ketosis or even ketoacidosis (breath smelling like fruit or nail polish remover, increased blood acidity, possibly elevated insulin levels) and phosphofructokinase deficiency (exercise-induced muscle cramps and weakness, dark urine, high uric acid in the blood, gout, renal failure). Anyway, that's my guess. Oh, and beware fatiguing adrenals with caffeine while doing the rest of this overdriving. You might get the same good feeling from a milk enema (milk has palmitic acid). Or maybe the palmitic acid levels are much higher in milk and would result in a dangerous degree of button mashing? Try a dilute milk enema, maybe. You know, like a decaf cuppa joe with a dash of cream, sugar optional.

Caffeine along with the theophylline, theobromine and paraxanthine do aid in the metabolism of fats. This is because these xanthines are cyclic adenosine monophosphate phosphodiesterase inhibitors (cAMPPDEIs). This is why they are used in so many weight loss products such as weight loss pills and cellulite creams.  It was not that many years back that everyone had an ephedrine-caffeine weight loss product on the market. The ephedrine was used to stimulate cyclic adenosine monophosphate (cAMP) release, which stimulated the burning of body fat. But it was short lived in the body because an enzyme known as cyclic adenosine monophosphate phosphodiesterase would break down the cAMP. So the caffeine or other xanthines were combined to inhibit this enzyme thereby prolonging the fat burning effects of the ephedrine stimulated cAMP.

But none of this has anything to do with the crashing of the adrenals. That is simply from the release of epinephrine and corticosteroids from the adrenals faster than the adrenals can produce them.  

Anyway, Hveragerthi, don't rely on the advocates who base their beliefs on hearsay to be the ones to give you the information you need.

I don't at all. I rely on what has been known about the human body for decades and real studies, not it must work because I feel better testimonies. Cocaine will also make them feel better, this does not make it beneficial or healthy.

Nor should you condemn coffee enemas outright because the advocates are underinformed or misinformed (re Gerson's track record, e.g.). (You don't actually seem to be doing this, though.) You'll need to do your own research.

 I never condemned them outright. That is just the portrayal that is being presented by a few here that do not like me. All I did was to point out that the caffeine in the coffee can have adverse effects on the adrenals. which is CONTRADICTORY to the work they were doing to try and build the adrenals. I cannot help it if a few people here over react to what I posted because they shot their nerves with coffee enemas. Here is a copy of my original post. As anyone can see I was merely pointing out the contradiciton:

He is definitely right about the nettle leaf. Great stuff. Nettle leaf helps the adrenals, thyroid, liver, kidneys, intestines, etc.

What I do disagree with is the coffee enemas. They are using the caffeine to stimulate the liver, but caffeine also crashes the adrenals. So on one hand you are building the adrenals with the nettle leaf and licorice root, but tearing down the adrenals with the caffeine.

Using digestive bitters is a better way of cleansing the liver without crashing the adrenals in the process.

http://curezone.com/forums/fm.asp?i=1455932#i


http://curezone.com/forums/fm.asp?i=1445229#i

So as we can see I never said coffee enemas were outright bad. Some people here were just looking to pick a fight because they are on a power trip. That is why I appreciate your discussing the topic instead of also picking a fight. Thanks again.