Trysten3000,

I know that the "hurt" that you are feeling is uncomfortable, but without the hurt, your "love" would just be a word (cold). If you've ever noticed, very often there seems to be an almost cosmic/spiritual connection between a lot of words (hurt/heart). The hurt that you feel is actually a "glow". It is the kind of love that the human being was meant to have (SENTIMENT, not mere "emotion"). It is the kind of love that yields "rivers of living waters" from the heart and that flow through the eyes. Make the fine distinction between EMOTION and SENTIMENT. Many people can experience many emotions and be subjective, but not everyone can experience the one true sentiment in their heart. He will never have the ability to understand sentiment. Understand that he is pathetic and deserves "pity" (and he doesn't even know it, but that is by his own doing). Subjectively (emotionally), you will "SUFFER" the "CONSEQUENCES" of what has happened and feel "PAIN", even though you know you don't deserve to suffer, neither do you deserve to feel pain. You also will experience [BAD] "CONSEQUENCES" even though you subconsciously realize that you don't deserve to. So, why not simply "ENDURE" "RESULTS" and experience the "SENSATION" of doing so.

I never realized until last year that this is what I subconsciously did for 51 years. Do not become "bitter", but "better" for the experience (stronger than you were, no one is better "than" anyone else).

I apologize for the length of this post, in advance - seems this always happens when I start thinking about my own experiences! LOL

When I left my ex, we had two sons that we needed to communicate together about. Of course, any communications with my ex was an exercise in futility and he never, ever placed the well-beings of our sons, first, before his ego. I would even find myself feeding into his supply by stroking his ego (rather than discussing why our eldest son had run away from home), or by attempting to chit-chat about HIS interests (rather than demanding that he take an active role, even though we were divorcing). He had effectively severed all of my ties with my safety network and frienships, so I was pretty much alone without friends to help me through. Because he had chosen our "mutual" friends, I had little hope of finding support from them - he had already told them that I had left him for another man, but that I had "turned lesbo" at the same time.

As a matter of fact, one of the things that I did was to keep a running log of all conversations that we had. I would also copy and file away (paper copies, not computer memory) any correspondences that went between us. About 2 months ago, I had to go through those piles and piles of papers and became physically ill when I started reading through the %¤#&!§-that I played into after I left that man.

We ALL go through that WITHOLD/REWARD game when we're dealing with a narcissist - whether it's a boyfiend (not a typo), parent, sibling, coworker, etc. They will reward us with their attention when we give them their narcissistic supply. And, we have to learn the hard way - we wouldn't have chosen these %¤#&!§-s if we had known what we were in for, right? So, we have to learn in the most painful way. The upside of this is that the difficult, hard, painful road to awareness has its own benefits: we can evolve into wise Survivors by experience. Some folks (ME, especially) can be beaten over the head with the Shoe Of Knowledge and I just don't get Today's Lesson unless I pick up the shoe and put my nose in it, personally.

Bottom line here, Trysten, is that we all make mistakes. Sometimes a number of times before we get the gist of the Lesson. Once you've acknowledged that Love does not require Pain, you'll be able to move on and begin to focus on evolving your Self (Life's Spark) beyond this particular point in your Life's Road. Although I understand your heartbreak only too well from my own personal experiences, this is only a temporary situation. This will not go on for the rest of your life, I promise.

About the mutual friends issue, do not discuss the issues between the two of you with ANYbody who is a "mutual" friend or even people that you believe are "best" friends - the narcissist is very careful to cover all bases where their property is concerned and they invent the most ludicrous stories possible in order to make us, the victims of their games, look as if we're just nuts. Well-meaning friends will often be coerced into "reporting" what we've been discussing with them and twist any tidbit of our personal lives around to use as weapons against us. Mutual friends with a narcissist are usually those people that the narcissist has screened and approved for his supply. They do not realize that they are being used and invariably get deeply involved in the deceptions that the narcissist will concoct to make themselves look better. "What happened to you guys?" can gently be answered with, "We just didn't have the same interests." Nothing more needs to be said. No defenses need to be invented to justify your actions. Nobody is deserving of an explanation - you are allowed (ENCOURAGED) to make wise decisions that will have a positive long-term effect on your Self. Anybody who wants to continue to discuss this guy needs to be cut off at the knees with, "I don't wish to discuss him, but thanks for your concern." End it right there - not one word more. This will put the ball back into their court and force them to either mind their own business or, if they're really dense, pursue the issue. At that point, you are thoroughly allowed to respond by saying, "These issues really are none of your business unless I invite you to discuss them with me - I haven't, so let's move on to a positive topic."

You'll come out of this just fine, Trysten. Right now, it seems like the universe is just caving in on you, but that's what the narcissist is expecting from us and that's how they play their abusive games by making US feel as if WE are the ones who have deliberately inflicted damage for our own entertainment! You will be just fine and you'll be wiser for your experience.

Best of wishes to you!

I had no idea it was on - I just love the part where Celie is leaving, and he goes to strike her, and she forks the evil eye at him and stops him cold, and she says, "until you do right by me, everything you touch will crumble. Everything you done to me has already been done to you", and he proceeds to become miserable and reaps his karma, until he does right by her. Unfortunately, most jerks never get it, and start to do right.

You will come out of this better than ever if you choose, and he will slowly sink into the quagmire of his own making - you will feel marvelous if you just stay away for, oh let's say, EVER. Than when you do run into him years later, and he looks and sounds like horrible crap and you stand there tall and beautiful, ahhh that is a great feeling.

I will tell you something - I can no longer attract an abuser. They cannot sense in me today that "thing" that they could sense that said that I was abusable. I frighten them and they back away within a very few minutes. This is because I did the hard work of change in my own life. When I quit begging, pleading, "assisting", chasing, crying, focusing my energy on, etc. these CREEPS, and put the focus on what I could do to change ME, well, that is what made the difference. YOU CANNOT DRAG SOMEONE INTO THE LIGHT WHO DESPISES THE LIGHT. There are no longer any abusers in my life. Before now, I was a poop-magnet for these men - ALL of my relationships were abusive. Now, I do not have abusive family members, friends or lovers. What a blessed freedom this is. Now I have half a chance to really appreciate and love myself for the first time.

Gotta run to work - keep in touch

I just read the whole thread and it sounds a bit like a person I have been with when I was about 23. It wasnt physical abuse the way that some here experienced it but a very intimidating and manipulative way the person had. I could say so much about it.

Looking back at my own story andhearing you I must say that I believe the beginning of your attempts of cleaning up your life and control the drinking and smoking was probably the beginning of a cleanup in a larger scale. All of the sudden or rather slowly your body and mind understands what isnt good for you and it will slowly step by step change these habits. Well, your boyfriend was one of them and didnt fit into who you are now....maybe once he did fit in when you were weak and dependant of many things. You sound far too strong for him now. But its like quitting smoking- it's not easy and there are many traps. You cleaned up (or still are) you life and I am sure you will soon attract the kind of people who will sense that you have come to terms with yourself and that you will not tolerate abuse in any way.

I think its also important to understand that it is well possible that you love this guy (i think of this old boyfriend of mine I still have a lot of feelings) but that just isnt enough to be together. You should always love yourself more. What I mean is, he sure has his reasons for being like that and he sure is suffering and has aq good side to himself. So be it. maybe he can be good for someone else but he sure isnt good for you....

Hope you keep your direction! Good luck!

Back at you SS - I remember when you first started posting here and I thought who is this woman? She is such an amazing survivor. You definitely add value to Curezone on many levels.

Molly