then, you go on and on about EDTA and haley and mercury. after 4 months of chelation with the supplements if patients want to do EDTA, they can. there is not enough mercury left to make a difference. many want to do it immediately. i cannot stop them from doing it, only tell them wait at least 4 months. i did chelation myself, tell patients how to do it all week long, been doing it nearly 4 yrs and you post cutler is right and i am wrong. well, i don't agree, and you have the nerve to write that i don't know much about chelation. there are many drs out there that think cutler is wrong and just taking ppl's money, so i am not alone.
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i, like many others, do not believe in redistribution. i believe stirring up mercury with certain chelators and not pulling it thru with others, is a waste of time and can make u sick, but i do not refer to that as redistribution. we don't use dmps and dmsa. i don't believe in it and as far as i know levy and huggins are still against it. now, hal mite b using small doses, but that was a recent change and i am still not comfortable with giving it to our patients. you say i don't know much about chelation since i disagree with you. isn't that interesting. so i don't believe in the stuff u do, so what? who are u?
BUT ONE OF THE BIGGEST ATTACKS YOU MADE ON ME WAS SAYING I RECOMMEND TESTING FOR MERCURY. I DO EXACTLY THE OPPOSITE. I RECOMMEND AGAINST IT. but i listen to the patient. some want to do it no matter what. i will advise them against it, but with the new FDA lawsuit being talked about recently, it may be a good idea. i have had all the tests and i can use them in court if needed. attacking me about wasting ppl's money just takes the cake. why did you begin an attack on me and continue on with it?
there is a debate forum for ppl who want to argue about chelation. it is called the chelation debate forum. why don't you go there instead?
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there is a chelation debate forum for those who who want to debate chelation techniques.
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I posted some dentists in your area below.
No, the fillings, which contain mercury, should be taken out in sequential order and yes, some will be in the air, as mercury is very volatile. The dentist should use a good protocol to remove them (see below). You can take some activated charcoal (about 3 capsules) to help get stray mercury through the body without absorbing into your system much. the dentist should also give you a vitamin C IV drip to help chelate mercury while he is removing the fillings. You can begin chelating (taking oral supplements that rid the body of mercury) immediately after all your fillings are removed. You should do this at least 4 months. I list those chelators on my website. Getting the mercury out is half the battle to getting well; You must chelate the mercury out of your brain, lymphatic system, and organs. DMPS and DMSA are called provocation challenge tests. They test as well as chelate mercury, but they are dangerous, according to Hal Huggins and Dr. Levy, DDS, and should be avoided. They were invented for military personnel who get heavy metals dumped on them and designed to get it out quick. It puts toxic loads on the kidneys (even new lower doses being promoted are not safe) and can make you very ill. Dr. Thomas Levy is a cardiologist who co-authored Uninformed Consent with Hal Huggins. In the book, Drs. Levy and Huggins discourage the use of synthetic chelators in general, and DMPS in particular. At page 252 they state:
"Heavy metal chelators almost always overaccelerate the detoxification of the post-TDR (total dental revision) patient. DMSA, DMPS, and EDTA can all do this. DMPS is consistently the greatest offender here. Immune declines and clinical illness can result for weeks and sometimes even months after only one injection of DMPS". Dr. Levy...[says], "DMPS is an unqualified sledge hammer to the immune system". He referred to the administration of DMPS as an "assault". Dr. Levy believes that synthetic chelators should just plain be avoided most of the time. Most patients simply don't need them. http://www.dmpsbackfire.com/dmps/default.shtml To read more about mercury testing, see my FAQs webpage:
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as far as some of his comments, i can tell you that we have patients come in so ill they cannot stand and have had a couple ask for an ambulance to stand by during removal, they were that sick. we have them chelate only with the supplements and they can cut down the dosage a bit if they need to, but we do not use DMSA or DMPS or EDTA (altho the latter i will tell them they can in 4 months if they insist). we feel these drugs will make them worse and it is our opinions. just because it is not the same opinion as wintergreen, i never told him he didn't know about chelation. i could care less about debating chelation or else i would be in that forum doing so. i did not address him at all. if you read the posts, you will see the first and subsequent attacks on my methods and knowledge came from him. i was only respondeding to the poster and told them what i know and what we do.
also, there is absolutely science behind the chelation formula i use. i took most all of it out of dr morales' publication and it is all cited with scientific studies of known mercury chelating supplements. dr morales asked me to add a few current ones, so i studied some chelators that have been proven to chelate mercury, the dosages shown to do so, and i added them (about 5 or so) like he asked me to do. the base of the formula is taken right out of the publication and if it had no science behind it, i would had put that on my site. i was not promoting anyone. i was helping a poster by posting. u either did not follow these posts all the way and see what really transpired, or u just like to jump in and attack ppl for no reason yourself, don't know which. if u r not bias, i suggest u go back and read each one very carefully. here are the attacks on me by wintergreen that i defended myself to (the bottom one came first) and there are more, but these were the initial ones:
wintergreen wrote:
harleygirl: You can begin chelating (taking oral supplements that rid the body of mercury) immediately after all your fillings are removed. You should do this at least 4 months. I list those chelators on my website.
wintergreen: Are you aware of how dangerous the advice you are giving here is? Particularly to a woman whose brother is already in fragile health?
Taking alpha lipoic acid and cilantro immediately after your fillings are removed, particularly in the doses you state from your website replicated below, can make you EXTREMELY ill.
harleygirl: then, to top it off, he says first do no harm, like i am a doctor. i took no pledge. i am consultant.
wintergreen: "Do no harm" is a simple, basic, and essential ethical concern for anyone who offers health advice of any kind. And of course it would apply to a dental practice as well. Are you saying here that you are immune from it?
When you give out chelation advice, do you tell the patients you aren't bound by the constraint of "do no harm."
I assume that's not really what you mean. But throughout this whole exchange, you have placed yourself at the center of it. If you feel that I said something out of place, you could have noted it, and then moved on with facts and arguments, rather than returning to it again and again.
It is quite common to point out other's mistakes here. Earlier, you felt my advice was mistaken regarding mercury tests. I don't think you grasped my meaning in that discussion, but that is neither here nor there. You have called me a jerk and so forth, and I have not made any kind of issue of that. It's just not important.
This isn't about you, it's about getting out advice that won't hurt and that may help. And I will stand by my earlier statements that you don't know enough about chelation to be offering much in the way of helpful advice on it, aside from warning people not to do things like DMPS injections or DMSA challenge tests.
Huggin's account of the young woman and others who were paralyzed after taking EDTA is not primarily an account of his opinion, but of his experience. At the very least, I would have liked to think that this would give you pause rather than continuing to say that EDTA is fine, you just have to wait and use a few supplements for 4 months before you take it.
i have no idea why you keep saying i don't understand some point you made. i have a life and i don't sit and read your every word and try to decipher meaning. the moment you attacked me, i didn't want to read anything you wrote, in fact. you turned everything you wrote into something against me at that point. but, who would care if i misunderstand something you wrote about mercury. i probably don't agree with you, but who am i? you keep bringing it up, but why do you care what i think? you told me that you don't even live in america
i am also get a kick out of how you change everything around and deny everything you did. the funniest thing i read, this time, was that it wasn't about me. you got that from me, telling u that, lol. and, thing is, and u know what u did, unless u r in denial, u attacked me. i was minding my own business, never said a word to u, and all of the sudden you attacked all kinds of things and kept doing it. i defended myself and didn't attack you. if i called u a jerk, it was in defense to your attacks and much deserving.
i could tear apart everything u said about chelation like u did to me if i wanted to. i never went that route. i was only interested in the poster who was asking questions. you are the one who launched the attack. if ppl want to bother going and looking at the posts, they will see exactly what transpired, it's all here. BUT, unlike you, i think they have better things to do. i think no one cares whether you and i disagree on chelation techniques.
you keep writing and defending huggins and you try to pretend that i am telling ppl to take EDTA. for one, that is absolutely false and for another, it is none of your business. thirdly, and for the last time, if ppl want to take it, i tell them they can if they chelate orally 4 months. most often, they forget about it by then because they feel so much better. but, my mom's friend has heart problems and he has EDTA ever so often, i have had it myself. EDTA doesn't take out much mercury and if you have fillings or just had them out, not only will it not help much, it can make u sick because it is taking out other metals and putting them on the kidneys. but, guess what, i had a straight week of IV EDTA when i had 10 amalgams and was mercury poisoned for 30 yrs. that is what the doctors chose to do about it. i didn't get sick, but i didn't get better, either. so why tell me Huggins personal story when i have my own?
you can twist words and write bad things about me all you want. you never should have attacked me in the first place and then you would not have to waste energy trying to still point out things you think i am doing wrong. i am doing nothing wrong and i don't care if you think i am because it is my opinion that matters on that. you drug me into your debate a little, which i never did and still won't do. i am still not telling you that you are wrong about anything (except when you attack my character and how i do things), like you did. this all started because you chose to point out things you thought i was doing wrong and giving out the wrong info on chelation. you should have just ignored me and wrote your own ideas like i did. then, you would not have to b responding to me and keep attacking what i do and believe in. once again i will tell you, if you want to argue about chelation, go into the chelation debate forum. i am not interested in what you think i do wrong and i am not changing my opinions to yours.
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you mistakingly think this forum is for your own personal debate with whoever's chelation technique you don't like, which happens to be me at the moment. instead of attacking the way i believe about chelation, why not go put your time to better use in the chelation debate forum?
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