sensitivities 
bling
16 y
3,728
A few years ago, i had this test at local health food store, and was told i had a marked sensitivity to dairy and wheat, but still eat those, more fool me, and have sinus and cattarhal problems,ie inflammation, also tomato, pineapple, sardines, brussel sprouts, corn, chocolate, i think that was all. So won't break fast on tomato or pineapple.
Now, after a fast, is it possible i won't be sensitive to these anymore. I'm going to do an Elimination Diet after fast anyway, adding things back in slowly, and leaving 48hrs to see if it has affected me, is that long enough? I suspect that my aches and pains will improve as well, once i get rid of the cause of this inflammation, the cattarh is a symptom i can see, what is it doing to rest of body i wonder?
I have so many reasons to do this fast, the list gets longer, the more i think about it. I just can't wait to get these committments out the way, so i can start again, i keep firing myself up to do this, with nowhere to go. Maybe i'll cancel my committments, say i'm not well, i'm tempted, and if i get remarks on being too skinny, when i eventually see these people, i can blame the illness, trouble is i hate lying, i'll just get embarrassed.
I don't want to lose to much weight, will it slow down, according to my size? I can afford to lose about 10lb, then i'll start to look to thin, well maybe a few more pounds, as will put that back on i suppose fairly quickly.
Thanks
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- Re: sensitivities 1234567
16 y
3,812
MoreThis is a reply to # 1,122,809Morning Bling:)
Well, my weight is still the same after 8 days since my 10 days fast was over. As you possibly read in my previous posts I also was not overweight before my fast. By now I can't say I am extremely thin but I am thin. I still need to gain back about 8 pounds to have my ideal weight.. During all this time, esp first week, I was mainly on salads and fruits. So dramatic weight gain I shouldn't have expected. Ok, lets think (and it is true) that all that extra weight lost was water and toxins. And as soon as we put back on weight it will be healthier flash:)).... Uff, still can't wait when it happens! :D
All the best to u, Bling!
Nadia
Ps: Today in Glasgow again horrible weather! It rains heavily and very windy:(... Weather was so much better yesterday!:/..:)
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- Re: sensitivities bling
16 y
3,632
This is a reply to # 1,122,818
Yes overcast and cold today. Still juicing, experimenting mixing different things together, about to do weekly shop, so been trying to get rid of all the left over fruit and veg in the house, so i hope i haven't overdone it this morning, i've had lots of strawberries, grapes, which although it seemed alot of fruit, wasn't that much juice. Spinach, carrot etc. I did broccoli yesterday because it was left over from a meal, bought one that was to big, and thought i would suffer from wind, lol, but i was fine. Actually the raw doesn't affect me like the cooked. The trouble is i'm losing weight already on my healthier regime, so won't have much left to fast with. Mind you if i stop the Armour, that will stop the weight loss a bit on the fast i think. I think 5 days is enough to then start doing food elimination, but not sure. So i might fit a 5 day in soon.
What is the hardest, the fast or the re-feeding part?- Re: sensitivities 1234567
16 y
3,738
This is a reply to # 1,122,832In my case re-feeding part was much difficult. When u are just on water, no hunger, and no need to control the amounts of food consumed - it is EASIER (for me):)
Nadia
- Re: sensitivities 1234567
16 y
3,738
- Re: sensitivities chrisb1
16 y
3,601
This is a reply to # 1,122,818Nadia,
to aid you in gaining extra healthy weight I would strongly recommend "Rebounding". Look it up on the net.
Start off slowly and for a few minutes a day, building up the time over time.
This will also improve digestion & assimilation to a remarkable degree.
Regards
Chrisb1.- Re: sensitivities bling
16 y
3,599
This is a reply to # 1,122,833Chris, I have one, but found i can't use it with my neck and back problem.
Maybe i will be able if it eventually gets fixed.
I loved using it though, it was so easy to just jump on it for a few minutes throughout the day, but my neck got bad..oh well! - THANKS Chris!:) I will look for it!:... 1234567
16 y
3,712
- Re: THANKS Chris!:) I will look for ... chrisb1
16 y
3,591
This is a reply to # 1,122,858I think bling must have been bouncing too hard to do his back in.!!Lol.
Some good offers on EBay for rebounders. A second hand one will do. Reebok is a good choice.
Chrisb1.
- Re: THANKS Chris!:) I will look for ... chrisb1
16 y
3,591
- Re: sensitivities bling
16 y
3,599
- Re: weight gain. Fonty
16 y
3,761
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This is a reply to # 1,122,818Hi Nadia. I'm just interested in what you base your ideal weight on? If you've been eating for 8 days since you broke your fast and not put any weight on I'd say there's a good chance that, unless you've been really undereating, that you are there now. Flesh shouldn't be added for the sake of it, it will only be added back in fat stores if needed, and in muscle mass if that is needed- or stimulated by strength exercises. I think it's probably just as important not to think you should weigh more because of what some chart says your weight should be, any more than you should lose weight for the sake of it. It sounds like you are eating a great diet now high in nutrients and if you needed to put on weight I think you would already have done so.
Andrew.- Re: weight gain. 1234567
16 y
3,876
This is a reply to # 1,123,222Hi Andrew:))
Ok, about my weight.. I don't base my ideal weight on any kind of chats or measures from the books. I would say it is just an accurate observation. I am around 5'10 and between the age of 20 and 30 my minimum weight was 132 and the maximum - 187 pounds. The most 'comfortable' weight for me when I feel good 'in my skin' deviated between 152-158 (69-72 kg). Now I am 147,5 (67). Why do I think it is not enough for me? - My arms (near shoulder area) should be a bit 'thicker'), legs a bit more round. Bum - I had 'better times with the shape of it':))).... I do not undereat. I would say even I ate a bit more often during re-feeding period (though small amounts) and have already eaten yogurt and salmon on day 7. May be I didn't put on weight coz during those 7 days I ate mostly fruits and vegies which contain not that much calories as protein food. May be within 2 weeks time I will notice results.. Also, I want to add here, I don't exercise now (just afraid to loose more weight):/...
Nadia
- Re: weight gain. chrisb1
16 y
3,825
This is a reply to # 1,123,296Nadia,
High water content food, such as fruit and veggies tend to be low calorie and therefore any weight gain can be mostly water.
If you are concerned about not being able to put healthy weight back on, I would suggest several things.
Firstly, eat more of the healthy fat & protein foods such as avocados: they are full of vitamins/minerals, essential fats, and are considered to be a good source of protein. Mexicans substitute avocados for meat as a healthy way of receiving their protein too. Bananas are good too. (not the ones in pyjamas).
Secondly, for some people (like me) it does take time to put weight back on post-fast, it depends on your powers of digestion and assimilation, not just the type of food you are eating. It can take a while for your body to kick-start a rested stomach, so patience can also be the name of the game here.
Thirdly, it also depends on your level of physical activity after your fast: do not expend more calories than you are taking in, which might seem to be a logical explanation.
Fourthly, in a sedentary occupation such as mine, I actually GAINED weight on ONE meal a day, as opposed to overtaxing the digestive apparatus with three meals a day, as is customary in the Western hemisphere.
I am not a farm-hand, expending thousands of calories a day by physically active work, so do not need to eat like one to replace that lost nutrition. If you do not expend those calories, they just do not need replacing.
Your appetite will return more and more, and as time progresses your desire for food will increase, listen to what your body is telling you. Also, if you try "gentle" rebounding as well, for just a few minutes each day, that will also help with your digestion and assimilation of foods to a remarkable degree and therefore help with your weight-gain. It is the ONLY "cellular" exercise in existence, and used by NASA to physically train their astronauts.
Shelton was also an advocate of various forms of exercise from mild to strenuous for improving the powers of digestion.
Regards
Chrisb1.
- Re: weight gain. Fonty
16 y
3,572
This is a reply to # 1,123,296If you want to gain that weight back I'd encourage you to exercise the parts of your body you especially want more bulk on and increase your intake of food, maybe an extra ration or two of raw nuts here and there. Let your body know what you want by stimulating those areas.
Andrew.- Re: weight gain. bling
16 y
3,794
This is a reply to # 1,123,482
Chris 'n' Fonty,
I'm still abit confused about the refeeding business. I've just received another fasting book i ordered. 'Fasting and Eating for Health by Joel Fuhrman,M.D.'
I find this a strange combination an MD and fasting, lol, don't normally go together, usually pedalling drugs.
Anyway, he says the usual. Gradually increasing, small amounts etc for first 3 days and then by day 4 eating 3 normal sized meals a day, but doesn't specify length of fast. So if i did a 14 day fast for example, can i be eating 3 meals a day, by day 4, and thereafter, as long as maninly fruit and veg, and minimal protein, nuts, seeds, wholegrains, for the remainding time refeeding, and can i eat meat in this time, or not advisable. He says to avoid pepper and spices as can irritate fragile stomach during this time. I'm just confused as all the information talks about the first few days after a fast, but not that clear on the remaining refeeding time. I could do with a list of foods i can or can't eat during this time.
He also mentions witnessing some hypothyroid patients, having normal blood tests after fasting. So Shelton and Fuhrman both have now said this.
I also ordered a juice fasting book, and they say some are drawn to waterfasting and some just can't do it no matter what, and are more suited to juice, and you will know. I thought about this, and i think i am drawn to the waterfasting. I'm not sure that juice fasting can balance the endocrine system, as the water seems to do. But the juicing is good anyway, for everyday health.
Was going cold turkey with caffiene today, and accidently put real teabag in mug instead of decaff, so had one, but doing well, want to be off all caffiene by Monday.
I'm also not overweight, so don't want to get to skinny. Nadia seems to be going very slow with the refeeding, that is why when he said 3 normal meals by day 4, i wondered is that correct??- Re: weight gain. chrisb1
16 y
3,773
This is a reply to # 1,123,523Hello bling,
you can find a lot of conflicting information about refeeding after a fast, but I tend to rely on the most experienced advice available: Dr Sheltons.
He states.................................
"The care that must be exercised in breaking a fast is in proportion to the length of the fast and to the general condition of the fasting individual. The approved plan is to break the fast on liquid food, using for this purpose fruit juice, or tomato juice, or Watermelon juice, or vegetable broths. Fruit juice--usually orange juice--is used most often.
Orange juice, grapefruit juice, or fresh tomato juice are excellent with which to break a fast. Watermelon juice or the juice of the fresh pineapple or of fresh grapes may also be used. A half a glass may be given at the start. After an hour, another half glass may be given. Juice may be given every hour the first day. The second day a whole glass of juice every two hours may be employed. On the third and fourth days give the whole orange or grapefruit and on the fifth day other foods may be added. Large meals should not be attempted in less than a week. These instructions are for the long fast. A short fast requires less care in breaking and is usually followed for several days by an eliminating diet.
There is a tendency on the part of the faster to overeat, not alone because he is hungry, but also because he is desirous of regaining his weight. His friends also urge him to eat. Sinclair truly says: "A person at the end of a (long) fast is an agitating sight to his neighbors, and their one impulse is to get a 'square meal' into him as quickly as possible."
Almost any food may be employed in breaking a fast, although greater care must be exercised if the concentrated types of food are employed for this purpose. There are individual factors that must receive attention. Sinclair tells of breaking a fast on a large, thoroughly ripe Japanese persimmon, and says that "it doubled me up with the most alarming cramps." A friend of his had the same experience from the juice of an orange; "but he was a man with whom acid fruits had always disagreed." The tendency of the long fast is to remove these digestive shortcomings, but it is not always completely successful, and this is especially so where the fast has not been carried to completion."
http://www.soilandhealth.org/02/0201hyglibcat/020127shelton.III/020127.ch30.htm
*********************************
Dr Joel Fuhrman MD was an internee of Sheltons and studied Hygiene and Fasting under him for a few years, so he should know what he is talking about.
It is probably not advisable to eat concentrated proteins such as meat or cheese, within the first week, but again that will depend on the length of the fast..... the longer the fast, the more care in refeeding by building up slowly and not overeating. Peppers and spices are to be definitely avoided as Dr Fuhrman is quite right of course for the reasons he has given.
Any food that is raw and in its natural state would be advisable for at least the first month, followed by a Hygiene-recommended 80% raw and 20% cooked thereafter; properly combined foods will also be of enormous benefit to your health and digestive system generally. Avoid any processed foods altogether.
There are three very good books on the market that could be very helpful for you here:......................
"Food Combining Made Easy" by Dr H M Shelton.
http://www.hsu.com/more_food_combining_books.htm
towards the bottom left of the page
Dictionary of Natural Foods by Dr William Esser.
http://www.amazon.com/Dictionary-Natural-Foods-William-Esser/dp/0914532308/re...
Superior Nutrition (Paperback) by Dr Shelton.
http://www.amazon.com/Superior-Nutrition-Herbert-M-Shelton/dp/0960694811/ref=...
**********************************************
"He also mentions witnessing some hypothyroid patients, having normal blood tests after fasting. So Shelton and Fuhrman both have now said this."...............
Something I have always maintained within my posts in the forum.
In my 30 years experience with Hygiene and Fasting, I have never read any evidence to assume that some people are not suitable for water fasting. There are contraindications in serious illness such as Liver Cancer, but these are exceptional cases and not the "norm".
Juice fasting is extremely beneficial, but results are very disappointing when compared to a water fast: the true state of ketosis and autolysis are not reached in a juice fast, resulting in inefficient cleansing and healing.
For the maximum benefit, you should abstain from anything but water.........no tea bags.........no caffeine..........just water, or you are only feeding yourself on a reducing diet.
Try not to be overly concerned with the loss of & gain of weight during and after your fast......................
http://www.soilandhealth.org/02/0201hyglibcat/020127shelton.III/020127.ch17.htm
http://www.soilandhealth.org/02/0201hyglibcat/020127shelton.III/020127.ch31.htm
Regards
Chrisb1.
- v excellent post on refeeding & food... l*u*l*u* 16 y 3,637
- Re: weight gain. Fonty
16 y
3,713
This is a reply to # 1,123,594I agree with most of what you've put there Chris. I do worry about this bit though:
"Almost any food may be employed in breaking a fast..."
I think this is very misleading and Shelton could have been more careful with his wording. I'm sure he didn't mean we should be breaking our fasts with chocolate or hamburgers! I think a definition I've read other is a bit clearer, though again I'm hopeless at remembering my sources! The defintion though adds clarification in that it says any 'natural food' and usually it is recommended that it's a single food to start with- so rather than having a fruit salad just one single natural food at each 'meal' to begin with after breaking a long term fast.
It is also well to remember that a lot of information from people like Shelton is regarding the breaking of a completed fast, which is actually considered safer to break than a fast that we artificially cut short. When natural hunger returns the body is ready to eat again, whereas if we break our fast before that we are bound to shock the system to some extent and even the right foods could give us a rough ride, as evidenced in your quotes saying ripe fruits gave stomach cramps to two fasters.
As for the time of the Recovery period, I believe it's an equal amount of days for the amount of time fasted. Dr. Fuhrman may have done shortish fasts each of similar durations, it's been too long since I've read any of his stuff, but to give a set amount of days for recovery I believe he must be talking about a set amount of days for the fast- or near to. I think that maybe a 50 day fast could take less than 50 days to recover from, but I think a 2 or 3 week fast does take the full amount of time you fasted to recover. And more emphasis is spent on the first few days because that is the most important, so as not to overtax the system with the first feedings. I do think that mostly fruit and/or high water content vegetables should only be consumed for the first week at least after a long term fast. By this time as we increase our intake the digestion system should be functioning normally and regularly again and more diverse and concentrated foods added gradually. It's more a matter of listening to the body than following a set plan. If the orange you planned to break your fast with is giving you cramps then it's either a sign the orange wasn't a good idea or the timing wasn't. If it's the fifth orange after the fast that starts to disagree with you it could well be the quantity so it would be wise to miss the next scheduled 'mealtime'.
I advocate eating mostly raw- up to 90%- throughout the recovery period, but then I believe that is how we should be eating mostly anyway. I think if you do that post fast you will get the full benefit of the fast you've done and will have very little chance of any ill effects from rushing your body back to a 'normal' diet. I don't believe for a second that you can 'undo' the benefits of a 2 or 3 week fast with a few days of bad eating, but you can certainly do some damage during the recovery period and it really is worth trying to get the most out of your efforts.
Andrew.- Re: weight gain. chrisb1
16 y
3,697
This is a reply to # 1,124,189Hi Fonty,
I think Shelton, when he referred to "Almost any food may be employed in breaking a fast..." was written at a time when processed foods were virtually unheard of, and before the Food Corporations had got their hands on dictating what we should be eating..............so we can line their pockets for them.!!
You are quite right, these days, that could be a misleading comment, and some of Sheltons works could be updated and edited slightly to adapt more to contemporary thought.
One notable example here I suppose, is that of Dr John Harvey Kellogg, a notable health-reformer of his time with his famous Battle Creek Sanatorium. You only have to investigate how perverted his own food creations became in later years to understand this.
I wouldn't disagree with anything in the rest of your post, which is, as always, very informative and enlightening to us all.
Regards
Chris.- Re: weight gain. Fonty
16 y
3,640
This is a reply to # 1,124,202Yeah we studied Dr. Kellogg in school, so not all schooling is a waste of time I guess! lol We were actually taught that he would be turning in his grave if he knew what they were feeding kids in his name these days.
I'm glad you can find the quotes so easily Chris, I remember reading most of the important stuff, especially when prompted by questions, but damned if I can reference those memories to their sources!
Andrew.- Re: weight gain. chrisb1
16 y
3,604
This is a reply to # 1,124,224Remembering quotes Fonty is just something that has always come fairly easily to me. My brother, on the other hand, can't even remember where his car keys are?
Could be the fish oil I take every day........you never know.
I suppose, 30 years of involvement with Natural Hygiene has helped, and as my wife says......."If you throw enough mud, it will stick" Lol !!!!!!
- Re: weight gain. chrisb1
16 y
3,604
- Re: weight gain. Fonty
16 y
3,640
- Re: weight gain. bling
16 y
3,647
This is a reply to # 1,124,189
Thanks Andrew,
He fasted most of his patients about 3 weeks, as they were there about a month, and got them to have a bm before sending them home. Although he did fast some longer depending on why they were there.
He recommends that people of normal weight, to only fast about 2 weeks. Although he say fasts of 14-28 days are good for recovering from medical conditions. I'm about 10lb overweight, and would like to go at least 3 weeks.
He says fruit should neither be to ripe or to underripe. Otherwise can cause stomach cramps. And i've learnt why we need to be careful, digestive enzymes need to be built up again, as these were used and non existant on re-feeding. Stomach lining is also thin, hence no herbs or spices etc.
Now another thing worrying me, he was saying that although electrolytes were usually quite stable throughout a fast, they need to be checked. He said there was a guy in his clinic that was 2 weeks into his fast, and his electrolytes were getting to low and he stopped the fast, although this guy was annoyed about it, as he felt okay. He said 1 in 100 may get to low electrolytes and it can be dangerous
to carry on.
Now is there anyway of testing electrolytes yourself. He said sudden weakness was one sign.
Why i'm worried is my mother a couple of years ago was put on bp med, which was a durectic. She was told no salt, so she was taking no salt and taking these meds that were taking salt out her body. She got more and more depressed, and ending up in hospital with mental problems, and they found her body devoid of salt, which had caused minor strokes in brain. She is still not completely right. So obviously this scares me, as i've seen the affects.
I'm not happpy to go completely on raw diet at this stage. I would like to know if i can introduce grain during the refeeding period, such and rice or quinoa, and can i have bread, as i do plan an elimination diet, as i suspect wheat and dairy, so would only want to eat a small amount to test affect on me. Can i eat nuts, seeds during refeeding, say after the first week.
Thanks- Re: weight gain. Fonty
16 y
3,619
This is a reply to # 1,124,209I know absolutely nothing about electrolytes so I guess that will be my next research subject! It's always fun trying to get the real information about stuff from medical Science which seems to be woefully misinformed on so much that is really important.
If grains and bread are that important to you add them in after the first week, I'd try to stick to mostly raw with the grains though, add them to a salad or something similar. If you're not worried about weight gain an avocado and tomato sandwich is to die for after a fast. :) During refeeding you would only add one grain at a time, probably just one for the whole day.
And raw nuts and seeds are certainly okay, I'm not sure what portions to advise though. They can be eaten with a fruit meal but eat them after the fruit and allow up to 4 hours before eating again afterwards as the concentrated protein will need longer to digest.
Andrew.- Re: weight gain. bling
16 y
3,604
This is a reply to # 1,124,227
I've been reading some old posts, did search on electrolytes, and found one where you said to someone, i believe if the body gets low in any nutrients,or words to that effect, hunger will return.
I would like to believe that to, but when your health is on the line, you have to be cautious. I did ask once about adding Seasalt occassionally, and no-one answered that, as that contains all sorts. Would that interfer with a fast??- Re: weight gain. chrisb1
16 y
3,631
This is a reply to # 1,124,284Bling,
consuming sea-salt during a fast is really breaking the fast, as this constitutes external feeding.
I know for certain that Dr Fuhrman has terminated fasts prematurely, and before the onset of hunger because of a low electrolyte level, so it doesn't always follow that the body will recognize that deficiency, resulting in the return of hunger.
I personally think he was erring on the safe side, when to have continued would have been safe. It would take a broad spectrum of nutrient-deficiency before the body reacts and hunger returns.
My own first fast of 25 days was terminated for this very reason, although I felt fine towards the end as this deficiency materialized.
Regards
Chrisb1. - Re: weight gain. Fonty
16 y
3,621
This is a reply to # 1,124,284I do know that during a dry fast the body carefully maintains the salt/water balance in the body and I would consider it dangerous to play with that balance myself. And the thing is how do you know how much to add? I think just leave it to your body to take care of. If you're worried about your body prefast then prepare for it as well as you can and ensure you have the good quality reserves in your body that the body will thrive on. I have always erred on the side of caution, though as I've become more experienced I've been more and more trusting in my body. I've also improved my diet considerably so I believe the chances of running out of good reserves before detoxing fully has become a lot slimmer now than it already was.
Andrew.- Re: weight gain. bling
16 y
3,583
This is a reply to # 1,124,480
Is a month of a lot of raw and juices etc, long enough to prepare?
I'm gearing up for i'm hoping 3 week fast in April. Raw juices have stacks of potassium in.- Re: weight gain. chrisb1
16 y
3,559
This is a reply to # 1,124,772In my opinion bling, yes, a month of raw food and juices should definitely be sufficient time to prepare your body for a 3 week fast in April.
Many people just do not have anytime to prepare because of an illness/disease, and rely on their previous diet of sometimes years standing to see them through successfully, so you will be in a much better position than they.
Regards
Chrisb1. - Re: weight gain. Fonty
16 y
3,530
This is a reply to # 1,124,772Any time preparing is better than no time. One month would be great preparation!
- Re: weight gain. chrisb1
16 y
3,559
- Re: weight gain. bling
16 y
3,583
- Re: weight gain. chrisb1
16 y
3,631
- Re: weight gain. bling
16 y
3,604
- Re: weight gain.
- Re: weight gain. chrisb1
16 y
3,697
- Re: weight gain. chrisb1
16 y
3,773
- Re: weight gain. bling
16 y
3,794
- Re: weight gain. chrisb1
16 y
3,825
- Re: weight gain. 1234567
16 y
3,876
- Re: sensitivities bling
16 y
3,632
- Re: sensitivities golthing
16 y
3,679
This is a reply to # 1,122,809You haven't told us how long of a fast you are doing.
"Now, after a fast, is it possible i won't be sensitive to these anymore."
If you fast for 5 minutes, I would say no, the fasting won't help your food sensitivities . If your fasting for 5 weeks, then yes. - Re: sensitivities Fonty
16 y
3,610
This is a reply to # 1,122,809You shouldn't be worried about losing too much weight. The more you lose the closer you will be to a clean and perfectly healthy body! And the weight lost will return where it needs to go. I think you might find that after fasting especially that if you eat those foods properly combined that they won't effect you the way they have been. My first wife got a rash from eating certain things, tomatoes sometimes but mainly oranges. She NEVER got the rash after reading Fit For Life and eating her oranges on an empty stomach and not mixing them with other foods. If she broke this rule the rash would return.
Pineapples are another case. Apparently they use some horrible chemical to fertilise them nowadays which inhibits the development of the sugars and prevents full ripening. They do this so they can ship them thousands of miles to our doorstep, but since they don't ripen properly (but are still sweet somehow!) the sugars are not so easily digested by us as fruit sugars are supposed to be. Therefore they should NOT be used to break a fast unless you can find organic ones. I guess that's why they lop off the leaves for us nowadays, because it's by tugging at the leaves we can tell if they are ripe or not!
Andrew.
- Re: sensitivities 1234567
16 y
3,812
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