Ecclesiastes, not one upright woman? 
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http://biblehub.com/ecclesiastes/7-28.htm
Limits of Human Wisdom (Study bible)
…27"Behold, I have discovered this," says the Preacher, "adding one thing to another to find an explanation, 28which I am still seeking but have not found. I have found one man among a thousand, but I have not found a woman among all these. 29"Behold, I have found only this, that God made men upright, but they have sought out many devices."…
What's your thoughts?
Solomon trips me up here.
Was he surrounded by that many bad wives, or just in a position where he could meet no women who cared about righteousness?
He's lamenting the state of men and women.
Does that mean there are not upright women..?
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- Re: Ecclesiastes, not one upright wo... refreshed
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This is a reply to # 2,333,979I think it is more interesting what he considered righteous...
29"Behold, I have found only this, that God made men upright, but they have sought out many devices."…
Hmmmm
- Re: Ecclesiastes, not one upright wo... illys / elisah
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This is a reply to # 2,333,998/Made/ that way, but they seek their own devices (their own way of doing things).
Man is the plural of humankind in basic english, It's the way Solomon discusses women that's curious.
Maybe the position he was in and the habits he had. (So man-EEE wiiiives)- Re: Ecclesiastes, not one upright wo... refreshed
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This is a reply to # 2,334,009Its a very good example of why we can't use only one sentence in the bible and make it into what we want it to say. In this case we need to read more to get the author's thoughts.
Wisdom and Folly Contrasted
1A good name is better than a good ointment,
And the day of one’s death is better than the day of one’s birth.
2It is better to go to a house of mourning
Than to go to a house of feasting,
Because that is the end of every man,
And the living takes it to heart.
3Sorrow is better than laughter,
For when a face is sad a heart may be happy.
4The mind of the wise is in the house of mourning,
While the mind of fools is in the house of pleasure.
5It is better to listen to the rebuke of a wise man
Than for one to listen to the song of fools.
6For as the crackling of thorn bushes under a pot,
So is the laughter of the fool;
And this too is futility.
7For oppression makes a wise man mad,
And a bribe corrupts the heart.
8The end of a matter is better than its beginning;
Patience of spirit is better than haughtiness of spirit.
9Do not be eager in your heart to be angry,
For anger resides in the bosom of fools.
10Do not say, “Why is it that the former days were better than these?”
For it is not from wisdom that you ask about this.
11Wisdom along with an inheritance is good
And an advantage to those who see the sun.
12For wisdom is protection just as money is protection,
But the advantage of knowledge is that wisdom preserves the lives of its possessors.
13Consider the work of God,
For who is able to straighten what He has bent?
14In the day of prosperity be happy,
But in the day of adversity consider—
God has made the one as well as the other
So that man will not discover anything that will be after him.
15I have seen everything during my lifetime of futility; there is a righteous man who perishes in his righteousness and there is a wicked man who prolongs his life in his wickedness. 16Do not be excessively righteous and do not be overly wise. Why should you ruin yourself? 17Do not be excessively wicked and do not be a fool. Why should you die before your time? 18It is good that you grasp one thing and also not let go of the other; for the one who fears God comes forth with both of them.
19Wisdom strengthens a wise man more than ten rulers who are in a city. 20Indeed, there is not a righteous man on earth who continually does good and who never sins. 21Also, do not take seriously all words which are spoken, so that you will not hear your servant cursing you. 22For you also have realized that you likewise have many times cursed others.
23I tested all this with wisdom, and I said, “I will be wise,” but it was far from me. 24What has been is remote and exceedingly mysterious. Who can discover it? 25I directed my mind to know, to investigate and to seek wisdom and an explanation, and to know the evil of folly and the foolishness of madness. 26And I discovered more bitter than death the woman whose heart is snares and nets, whose hands are chains. One who is pleasing to God will escape from her, but the sinner will be captured by her.
27“Behold, I have discovered this,” says the Preacher, “adding one thing to another to find an explanation, 28which I am still seeking but have not found. I have found one man among a thousand, but I have not found a woman among all these. 29“Behold, I have found only this, that God made men upright, but they have sought out many devices.”
- Re: Ecclesiastes, not one upright wo... refreshed
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- Re: Ecclesiastes, not one upright wo... illys / elisah
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- Re: Ecclesiastes, not one upright wo... rainy.8
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This is a reply to # 2,333,979Does that mean there are not upright women..?
---------------------------------------------
Not only are there no upright women, there are also no upright men except the man Christ Jesus.
Since all humans have sinned and none are good according to the Bible, except Christ, I have wondered if the one upright man could be prophetic of Christ. I really don't know. It could just be Solomon speaking of his own miserable situation with women.
As it is written, There is none righteous, no, not one: Romans 3:10
But we are all as an unclean thing, and all our righteousnesses are as filthy rags; and we all do fade as a leaf; and our iniquities, like the wind, have taken us away. Isaiah 64:6
This is why we have to except the free gift of God in order to receive eternal life. Jesus is that free gift to the world, but we have to receive Him. We get to be saved by His righteousness because ours will never be good enough.
- Re: Ecclesiastes, not one upright wo... tomi444
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This is a reply to # 2,334,126Totally disagree Rainy.
I have posted in respects of that recently so one must keep an open mind and believe in Christ.-
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- Re: Ecclesiastes, not one upright wo... refreshed
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This is a reply to # 2,334,202I think God made you very sharp minded Rainy. We just don't know what direction the number person wanted to go with the point made. Neither do we know what exactly that Tomi disagrees with.
Or perhaps I'm the one that is not too sharp here? :/- Re: Ecclesiastes, not one upright wo... rainy.8
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This is a reply to # 2,334,204Yeah, I couldn't figure out what he disagreed with either, lol. I basically just offered another possibility while I also said that I really didn't know. I thought that maybe it was my fault because I'm not the sharpest tool in the shed. Thanks for your kind words. Perhaps I'm just not the brightest bulb on the Christmas tree instead. ;)
- Re: Ecclesiastes, not one upright wo... rainy.8
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- Re: Ecclesiastes, not one upright wo... tomi444
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This is a reply to # 2,334,202My mistake Rainy, it's a common one to make here and I have followed suit.
"Since all humans have sinned and none are good according to the Bible, except Christ, I have wondered if the one upright man could be prophetic of Christ. I really don't know. It could just be Solomon speaking of his own miserable situation with women.
As it is written, There is none righteous, no, not one: Romans 3:10"
I thought "but Jesus saved from our sins"
Unfortunately I jumped to conclusions and never read your last piece on your post ...........
"This is why we have to except the free gift of God in order to receive eternal life. Jesus is that free gift to the world, but we have to receive Him. We get to be saved by His righteousness because ours will never be good enough."
Enough said, my tool needs honing, my apologies,
Where's that stone:) lol.
- Re: Ecclesiastes, not one upright wo... rainy.8
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- Re: Ecclesiastes, not one upright wo... illys / elisah
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This is a reply to # 2,334,229Thank God for you both, you're showing a spirit of unity and love between siblings in Jesus. :-)
Yeah, Solomon is discussing the unredeemed soul in that chapter- both men and women. It's interesting that he names a very tiny percentage of men.. though those he may have noticed having an honest heart- a servant's heart. (Like Jesus has).
There's a part of me that feels it is an important distinction to make- since there's true humility and false humility- the one tries to garner honour by taking on the appearance of it, the other is actually the broken and re-sculpted pot (scripture, Isaiah, God describes Himself as a potter, and humans as vessels).
On the surface this scripture can really look like sexisim, and it's annoying that so many people have taken it that way, at face-value.
I'm glad you posted the teaching from verse one to twenty-seven, Refreshed.
Perspective- point of view, makes a great deal of difference in understanding the words a person shares (and important in scripture).
Redeemed in Christ Jesus- washed clean in his blood- it's possible (and heck, if a person is taking the scriptures seriously, VITAL) to live righteously... but it's written more emotionally (do not grieve the Holy Spirit) than legalistically. It's a family relationship...? I honor my Father because He sent Jesus to pull me out of the mire.
Jesus is my older Brother, my high priest, my commander-in-chief.. I serve out of respect and love, therefore-?
Thoughts like the wind.
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- Re: Ecclesiastes, not one upright wo... refreshed
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This is a reply to # 2,334,283Thanks for your comments Illys. I couldn't help but think of a comment I read by Sir Ian McKellen, who is a well known actor, atheist, and homosexual.
He was asked whether it was true that he would tear pages out of the bible.
He confessed that it was true and that he was offended by "Do not lie with a man as one lies with a woman; that is detestable," as translated by the New International Version; the King James Version uses the word "abominable."
He said he didn't proudly deface the bible, but thought it a choice between tearing out the one page or throwing away the whole bible. Going on to say that when he stayed at hotels that he didn't want that scripture just inches from his head where he slept.
I couldn't help but wonder if the bible being so close to him, made it hard for him to sleep because God's word was speaking to him even when the book wasn't open.
My point being that he took one verse and decided that he didn't like what he read and closed his mind to what else God was saying. Did he know that you can read more verses, perhaps elsewhere in the bible that further explains why God allowed that to be put in the bible? Or did he just read that one verse and thought the bible was not worthy to learn more of what God had to say? Had he read on and read of the love of God, of where there is forgiveness and healing when we put ourselves in the arms of the Holy One, perhaps he would have looked at the verse differently? That God Himself, died on the cross for our sins, so Sir Ian could be freed from his sins and helped to be set free from the addiction to them.
But apparently Sir Ian was offended right off the bat and his heart and mind closed. He held tight to his right to sin. He didn't want to hear God tell him what is the best way to live our lives or how to be holy as He is holy. I'm sure we can all relate. We all have our pet sins that we don't want to give to God.
That is why it is so important that we take the bible as a whole and not in part or we miss the whole message.- Re: Ecclesiastes, not one upright wo... illys / elisah
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This is a reply to # 2,334,291That is the way it is for everybody who has the hutzpah to speak truth, especially in the world of 'relative truth'.
I suppose there's a point at which the hunger to discard the myths about YHWH becomes stronger than the offense. Though I find that reading through scripture in a cycle allows the depth of understanding to go forewards, like from stepping-stone to stepping-stone across a foggy river. Folk do slip into the water and get a cold dunk here and there, but the Holy Spirit is there to help us climb up and catch out balance again.
As for Ian McKellan, (I'm impressed to read he found scripture to be truthful), isn't it often a question of pride?
It's hard for a person to admit to themselves, 'I might be wrong'.
Please don't mistake me as having posted my original message as having taken offense to the bible- though I did post briefly because of the thoughts poking and prodding at that subject.
I think offenses form out of a person's experiences, not out of God's word being wrong.
It's usually peeps who get the interpretation askew, since there's a big tendency towards adding 'spin' to make the truth easier to swallow. Blech.- Re: Ecclesiastes, not one upright wo... refreshed
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This is a reply to # 2,334,292Right, he must believe it's God word or he would not be so incensed to tear the page out. If someone left a copy of classical mythology on the side of my bed in a hotel room, I don't think I would be tearing it up. He really needs to rethink whether he is a true atheist or not. The Holy Spirit is knocking at the door of his heart.
The question is...will he open it?
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- Re: Ecclesiastes, not one upright wo... illys / elisah
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- Re: Ecclesiastes, not one upright wo... illys / elisah
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- Re: Ecclesiastes, not one upright wo... rainy.8
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- Re: Ecclesiastes, not one upright wo... refreshed
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- Re: Ecclesiastes, not one upright wo... tomi444
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- Re: Ecclesiastes, not one upright wo... tomi444
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This is a reply to # 2,333,979Men are made to stand upright by woman.
It might be pride but they cannot take women for a ride.
So the question begs who's more upright, men?
Or is it that women are more righteous?
- Re: Ecclesiastes, not one upright wo... refreshed
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