Thanks. That makes perfect sense.

If a person has mercury trouble as well, it would be a good idea to chelate that poisonous stuff out too.

Don't use ALA if you have silver fillings though. That could be very dangerous.

"This opinion by Cutler is a mistake. "

== Wow, that is a very strong opinion regarding a 2001 post in an autism group about a *specific* case of a child who, from the information provided, quite possibly has problematic levels of more than one heavy metal.

== 12 yrs ago there was some theoretical information about ALA suggesting that ALA could lead to a reduction of excretion of copper in bile.

== Furthermore his audience is primarily those who have heavy metal problems. High body levels of copper are nasty enough on their own. The combo of high copper plus problematic levels of mercury or other HMs is even worse.

== He took the responsible position and warned people to reduce the copper for a couple of months before proceeding with chelation with ALA.

== Actually for most adults this issue with ALA was a non factor even when they had high copper. Most members come into the group shortly after they've had Amalgam removed. Cutler warns folks not to use ALA shortly after Hg exposure. Members reduce blood levels of HMs with DMPS or DMSA for a couple of months while also reducing their copper. Therefore typically there is no delay in the use of ALA.

"Cutler thinks that ALA makes copper toxicity because he observes the rise of copper in hair mineral analysis,"

== I'd be interested in seeing a quote from Cutler on this. This is actually contrary to what I've read from him on the subject. I certainly did not find that opinion in a quick skim of the copper sections of his book, Hair Test Interpretation.

... but this rise is very welcome because it indicates that copper is leaving storage sites....

== This is not what I've seen in the chelation groups; however it could easily be different for people who do not have a heavy metal problem--other than copper.

== Last year I followed the case of a new member, BrianMcB. in of one of the yahoo chelation groups. His hair test is #477
http://livingnetwork.co.za/chelationnetwork/hairtest/hairtest3/

He did the Cutler copper detox and his Cu was much improved in a couple of months. He reported some gains in his rather daunting list of symptoms over that time. He has documented his case in the FDC yahoo group. Cutler also commented in this long discussion.
http://health.groups.yahoo.com/group/frequent-dose-chelation/message/67503

Had once polished copper
http://health.groups.yahoo.com/group/frequent-dose-chelation/message/81141

Andy's response to ALA
http://health.groups.yahoo.com/group/frequent-dose-chelation/message/77647


== So in his case there was no delay in using ALA to chelate Hg. I exchanged a couple of emails with him over the weekend. He is coming along slowly as is often the case with such a sick middle aged person but he is quite grateful for the gains.

"So in my opinion there is no problem in taking ALA in copper toxicity ..."

== Over the years Cutler has softened his position on this as so many cases showed that copper buildup while on ALA was not a problem while on his protocol.

"...but be aware that ALA will also mobilize mercury and chelates it. Some individums are not able to tolerate even 1mg of ALA because of mercury."

== Very true. Not only that, it moves Hg across the blood brain barrier--in both directions. If you don't do it right you can end up moving Hg into the brain!

== Good luck.

== Joe

Regarding rapid detox, I have done some research and found several instances where a person with an autoimmune disorder using drugs within the sulfydryl group, for example alpha lipoic acid, has caused reactive hypoglycemia. Perhaps the fact that ALA depletes the body of more than just wastes can raise concern for whether ALA is scary to use...

That's a real interesting link. Thanks.

Again this is an actual case, not the general guidelines we would find in one of his books.

The person's hair Cu is reported to be a whopping 320! I don't know the ref range but in another test a 42 yr old female's ref range was 12-35.

The 58 yr old man I mentioned in a previous post, BrianMcB, had hair Cu of 84 (ref 11-32) and it was off the chart high. So 320 sounds amazingly high.

Also earlier in the discussion the woman reported that she could not tolerate zinc supplements.

Finally liver problems due to mercury were suspected of being involved in the retention of Cu.

Andy also advised her to check for continued sources of exposure in her environment.

Is this situation common enough to be used to make a general rule about treatment of high copper?