Well, remember that the other issue is that of those herbs having a reputation for irritating the digestive tract lining making your intestines MORE sluggish - the elimination happenening is not from natural muscular force as it should be but from the irritation that those herbs are causing. If true, then the muscular action becomes even more debilitated. So using those two herbs could mean needing to use more and more of them - have you had to use increasing amounts of those herbs over time to get the same effect, or only the same amount? And are there times that you personally have been able to go without those two herbs now that you are doing better? I ask you because your history shows an excellent amount of progress, and you use (or have used) these two particular herbs personally, so your answer to these two questions would be very useful.