Re: apocalypse now

Hello Naturalgirl,

My sympathy and empathy to you. What state are you in? Is there a local "Parents For Immunization Education" or similar group in your area? Groups like that are probably the best defense against lawlessness from Stalinist-type bureaucracy of this sort because it's useful to have backup as well as a larger experience base, potential publicity, and not to mention more eyes and ears to learn about the issues, the law, and the facts.

As for the child in the article, once you sign them into the "care" of your pediatrician friend, Dr. "Kaganovich" (or whoever), you may be at a great disadvantage unless you are very, very wiley and practiced.

I have had similar experience and actually have what may develop into a problem going on right now, but I am going to share something positive with you: it is extremely important to be Proactive, not defensive. Don't be snotty or threatening. And it's always best to ask QUESTIONS that will cause the would be Stalinist to threaten himself in his or her own mind (cowards did a thousand times, etc).

For example.

I have a special needs (Trisomy 21) son, now 12. When he was born, I was coerced against my will and over my objectins into signing a paper so the 'doctors' could give him a Hep C vaccine. Without going into the specific vaccine issues here, I told them "NO." So a nice lady pediatrician named "Dr. Sarah Goldstein" (name change to protect the guilty)... began making "child abuse and medical neglect noises." .

I had been awake since 2:30 AM when we rushed to the hospital, and after having been informed about the Trisomy 21 finding, I was somewhat overwrought and I allowed myself to be coerced into signing for the "shot."

BUT... before I did, the last thing I could think of to stave the b*tch off was to ask, "Well, I want to read about this vaccine so I know what is in it, and about potential side effects and so on. Do you have that kind of literature on hand?"

Dr. "Sarah Goldstein" looked at me as if I was some kind of noxious insect. "Sarah" replied, "No. We don't have anything like that."

Hours later, back home and on the Internet, I discoverd that Dr. "Sarah Goldstein" had lied to me. It's called a Packing Insert and they have it on hand for all the immunization "produts" they administer. Federal law requires that they must let you read it (Be sure to ask for a quiet room and copies of Merck, PDR, etc).

Days later, when we took the boy for his required check up at the hospital, another nice woman -- a nurse named "Nurse Rosa Luxemburg" (name changed to protect the guilty party) tried to coerce me into having him receive several vaccinations. When I declined, she started a controlled freak-out, crying, "we have to PROTECT this child!" she whined.

I looked at Nurse "Rosa Luxemburg" and I told her about the earlier incident with Dr. "Sarah Goldstein." I asked, "How many federal laws did that lady pediatrician break when she lied to me like that?"

Nurse "Rosa Luxemburg" immediately shut up about the "shots" and became very friendly and helpful about the rest of the check up. I should mention that she was wearing a bandanna over a bald pate becase she was undergoing "chemo-therapy" about which she cooed to me several times. A true believer, apparently!

WHENEVER you must deal with bureaucrats, always pay attention and be sure to put THEM on the defensive. Don't let them do that to you or you may lose your coomposure and make mistakes. Be informed and be prepared. Never set foot inside a hospital unless you are prepared to spy out at least three potential grounds for federal lawsuits. Avoid making affirmativie statement. ALWAYS answer their questions with QUESTIONS of your own. (!)
Take along a small tape recorder and a confederate or "next friend" as a witness and backup. When all else fails, tell them, "I have nothing to say" about that." If they ask, "are you going to answer all our questions that way?" say, "How should I know because I don't know what you are going to ask me." After a while you get good at it and it becomes fun. It's not wise to ignore their communications to you. Try to answer timely, hopefully with lots of questions, putting them in the hot seat.

For doctors who are pushy about vaccines, you can ask them to sign a waiver of immunity making them responsible to pay for the child's upkeep and support for life if the vaccine does any damage. Find one online and type your own version.

However, best to avoid them alltogether. Home school. Move to a state that supports the Rights you want to exercise (some states support more rights than others). If you live in a state that only grants vaccine exemptions for "Doctor's Judgement Calls" and "Religious objections," if you try to use the Religious objection and they tell you to prove you are a member of a certain recognized religious denomination to which they grant that exemption, ASK THEM how it is that they are establishing a religion, which is probably against thir state constitution, if it parallels the federal constitution's Bill of Rights (and many do).

Read your state constitution and its Bill of Rights, where they tell you what rights they recognize and support. Freedom of Religion originally was understood to be synonymous with "Freedom of Conscience." It wasn't even necessary to mention that in the state document, but times change and now Freedom of Conscience is rarely heard of, though it exists in several state constitutions.

FYI. We had planned a home birth with a midwife, but we did an ultrasound that showed placenta-previa; so home birth was out, so we arranged for a hospital "delivery." I altered several paragraphs on the admission papers and declined signing others. The "person" at the admission desk said, "Just sign these papers." When I told her I didn't want to sign some of them, she replied, "so don't sign them." Now how many people just sign them all, and in doing so, waive certain unalienable rights? You tell me?

I asked up front: "What is this all going to cost?" They refused to answer, though every aspirin, band aid, etc, is covered in federal cost regulations. By refusing to tell me up front, we had no contract with them. And while I had an obligation to pay them for a service, the amount remained in question and I had no obligation to just pay whatever they wanted to charge me. And I didn't do that, either. And what if an alleged 'service' is actually a disservice? "How can I agree to all of this when you won't tell me what it's going to cost?" That's a good thing to say to set your case, if need be.

"Hey! It says here, "I agree to pay any and all bills and charges?" What if someone charges me who isn't even connected with this case? Do you expect me to pay that? (Don't laugh...that actually happened to us).

When later harrassed multiple times to sign the birth certificate authorization form, I just cheerily told them, "I can't do that right now because we haven't named him yet! How can we name him when we only just met him?" Etc. Eventually I received a threatening phone call at home by a nice woman who said she was going to repot me. "To who and for what?" I responded. I did the same thing for the SS number. The hospital workers try to slip that in with the raft of forms they get you to sign.

Eventually (ten years later), when I decided to get a real job, and also put our son into a "real school," it became necessary to get him a Birth Certificate and SS#. If not for the Down syndrome, I think I probably would not have done that, or ever sent him to the govt. school. However, when submitting the required exemption from vaccine requirement letter, the school people didn't even bat an eyelash at accepting it. Afer all, it's the law. Taks care.