3rd time 
lees
11 y
5,717
RR Educational
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well I now have EC for a third time. Managed to be completely cured twice, last occassion I was completely healed was over two years ago, and have been EC free over all of that time.
I know how I got it this time, accidently bit part of my lip or more specifically the gums just below the vermillion border... which created an ulcer and the process began (I think one of the previous times I ate jalepeno's which also caused an ulcer that started the process). The ulcer caused my lips to dry, and skin came away from the vermillion border. It peeled once the skin below felt itchy and dry and peeled again. So far its peeled 3 times, and now onto the 4th set of skin
The peels take about 1 week to 10 days, very thick and crusty. When the crusts fall off, its still sometime a bit wet underneath (similar to my beginning experiences on the prior occassions). Towards the end of the peels last time, I think peels became increasingly thinner and thinner.
Wake up in the morning, and often there is whitish gunk on my lips where some of the lip has disolved into a pastey liquid while I sleep.
Trying not to move my lips, smile, sneeze which further rips the lips. Esp when new skin, very easy to create a rip in the centre of the lip. Difficult to talk at the beginning of a peeling cycle. After a few days, the lip starts to feel dry, slightly furry (you can really feel the difference between the areas north and south of the vermillion border). Opening and closing the mouth, near the vermillion the lips seem to stick together more.
Doing everything I can to keep the new skin / wound dry... I've become somewhat of an expert at doing this over time... and the process involves
- making sure everything you eat doesn't touch lips
- drinking in a certain way, so water doesn't touch (I do this by drinking onto my tongue and keeping a gap between my tongue and lips (the problem is always mainly on my lower lip)
- brushing the teeth in a certain way that the toothpaste stays away from my lips, including rinsing (this is the hardest - as quite often brushing can completely stuff them up
- and avoiding sweet food / drink as much as possible... the main reason being that the Sugar remains in the saliva and which eventually ends up on your lips... lips then become sticky and germy... not good.
gone back to moisturising with organic coconut oil. I am encouraging the lips to peel, but trying not to pick, or mess about with the new skin. Main purpose of the coconut oil is to help remove the dead skin, which tends to stick to the new skin underneath which just makes the whole crusting compound over and over itself... so once you eventually remove it (or accidently knock it off) you risk ending up back at square one by removing all the fresh skin... Its a fine balance, as you don't want to remove the skin prematurely or excessively rip it...
Not sure on the direction on removing the skin. I think from the front of the lip to the back is my preferred method
Last time around I also encouraged gradually the skin to be removed with my top lip (avoiding picking)
Other stuff is:
- toothpaste is organic, non flurogated
- soap and shampoo natural, but still using hand soap @ conveniences
- before I got this I was eating a lot of sugar, esp sweets and drinking soft drinks (for about 6 months, from having hardly any sugar)
- otherwise diet is mainly organic, mainly wholefoods, but not exclusively (was becoming increasingly mainstream)
- increasingly began drinking alcohol (approx 2-3 per week) from about 1 month beforehand, increased significantly in the 2 weeks prior
- lots of job related stress
- stopped exercising (bike riding) about 3 months ago
- no obvious sebbhorreric dermatitis at the time (I also get this periodically)
Anyway a bit of a bummer to be back here again... the stuff about roaccutane is interesting (I was on max dose for 12 months about 15 years ago). Sorry about being overly descriptive, this is partly here for my own reference so that I can figure out how to reduce the healing time and avoid onset.
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- Re: 3rd time Hopeful11
11 y
5,603
MoreThis is a reply to # 2,111,913When you first started the process before you cured how long did it take the thick crust to fall off your lips ?
- Re: 3rd time lees
11 y
5,412
This is a reply to # 2,111,916I did the wrong thing both times. The key thread to read is by monsterlip.
//www.curezone.org/forums/fm.asp?i=1827665#i
In my experience its best to avoid balms, chemicals, gels, making it wet - hence the advise to leave your lips alone. But at the same time you don't want weeks and weeks of buildup where all the dead skin stick together taking the new skin with it.
Using a natural oil containing no petrochemicals (coconut for me), can help remove the dead skin, but dont apply it to the fresh skin otherwise it will turn to paste in your sleep. Rather apply it to the healthy skin at the bottom and the bottom part of the scabs.
Unless your used to living with EC, it'll take you a while to adapt to brushing your teeth, keeping your scabs dry, how to drink and eat without moisture touching your lips... so maybe its best for you to start off clipping the scabs with some sterile scissors once they start to detatch and focus on keeping your lips dry as much as possible.
- Re: 3rd time xbcc
11 y
5,355
This is a reply to # 2,112,013So you do not put the oil on the middle part of the dead skin? You just put it at both ends? But then the middle part will just be stuck together because you don"t put oil on it...? How often do you apply the oil each day?
- Re: 3rd time Maxime77
11 y
5,521
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This is a reply to # 2,112,019with your technique you dont have redness on your EC affected area?
and how do you brush your teeth?i find it really hard to brush my teeth with having some toothpaste on my lips and without getting them wet when rinsing....- Re: 3rd time xbcc
11 y
5,610
This is a reply to # 2,112,034Brush your teeth with very little toothpaste, this way it is less likely toothpaste will touch your lips. You can also brush the teeth with no toothpaste and after that a short session with toothpaste. If you concentrate good enough, no toothpaste should touch the lips, or else dab it with a tissue. For rinsing, put water in your mouth through a straw, and water out also with a straw. It is a pain in the a** in the beginning, but you will get better at itm
- Re: 3rd time lees
11 y
5,391
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This is a reply to # 2,112,043Yeh exactly xbcc has some good pointers. You need to find a way that works for you (if you avoid Sugar there is less need to brush twice).
I used to use a shot glass to help rinse, but a water bottle would do the same trick.
Now I'm slurping from the tap, but I'm kinda adept at placing my tongue in the right position to avoid the paste touching my lips. I don't mind getting a small amount of water on my top lip (where EC is much less problematic).
I use a pea size amount of paste (sugar and SLS free - I found that maccleans freshmint really aggrevated and sticks to the EC, whereas the natural stuff doesn't to the same extent). Make sure the toothpaste sits at the back of the mouth. To do this you need to slurp it back if it accumulates anywhere near your lower lip.
Also I tend to spit out, when I've cleaned most of my teeth. Then I use the paste left on the brush to clean the bottom front... But if in doubt just avoid that section. You will eventually get the hang of it - one of the many things to adapt to changing after a while it becomes natural habit.- Re: 3rd time lees
11 y
5,511
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This is a reply to # 2,112,188The forth peel I finding some big improvements. I making some small tweaks to my diet has helped reduce the inflamation & EC production. Pity I only started taking photos 3 days ago.
NB - Theres no guarantee's these methods will work for others. Its most likely to help those in similar circumstances (ppl who are atopic/have allergies or IBS, or have taken roaccutane, or eat a poor diet).
- Re: 3rd time lees
11 y
5,511
- Re: 3rd time lees
11 y
5,391
- Re: 3rd time xbcc
11 y
5,610
- Re: 3rd time lees
11 y
5,358
Lugol’s Iodine Free S&H
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This is a reply to # 2,112,019The thick crust is just a build up of dead skin. It should eventually detatch itself, but it sticks to the new skin coming from the vermillion border.
Putting oil on dead skin doesn't help remove it (just soaks it. Like if you have a scab over your knee, would you put balm ontop to help remove it??
I put oil from the bottom of the lip up and under, working on the edges of the scab. And this helps encourage the skin to fall off when its ready, but avoiding forcing it off... that would cause aggrevation, or as longterm has called trauma.
If you don't like oil, try sterile nail clippers. (I also used to use my top lip to remove dead skin, but wouldn't recommend that! not unless you are finding significant improvements )
At the moment I'm using every 2nd day in the mornings. But once a day is also fine.- Re: 3rd time jsl123
11 y
5,363
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This is a reply to # 2,112,185lees you refer ec to as a "scab" do you really think ec is a wound? alot of posters have clashed on ec being a wound and most of us are pretty certain ec isnt a wound.. the leave it alone theory and keeping it dry most of us tried for several months and discovered that it actually makes the condition worse.. you should check out daniel millers website he nearly did about 1 year with no success..
what are your plans to rid of ec this time round? will you turn to your strict diet that you used the last time round you got rid of this? i remember you said it was a combo of diet and leaveing it alone... please share thanks in advance
also i pm you! thanks- Re: 3rd time lees
11 y
5,378
This is a reply to # 2,112,240Hi jsl.
Don't think I ever said to completely leave it alone??
You are right don't believe EC a wound in the strictest sense, but hey if you were to rip your lips which often happens with a peel, then it does create a wound site, same thing if you accidently smile and your lip cracks...
its like the things you do, to avoid creating a rip.. talking funny, making sure you don't laugh or sneeze... those rips expose fresh skin, which are soft and gooey like the inside of your mouth, thats not how your lips should be so a protective layer forms - i call it a scab but its semantics call it what you will.
The trick for me was to remove the skin at about the right time. Not too soon, not too late.
Took a look at Daniels pics on here... and there is some remarkable commitment. Brought me back a bit there, did the completely leaving alone for a couple of months and it was just as bad after that.
My plan is will be basic to start, don't eat sugar, don't drink alcohol, aim to get healthy skin underneath the peels and keep the healthy skin for as long as possible to be covering as much of my lip as possible, coconut oil to help repair rips and aid dead skin removal.
- Re: 3rd time lees
11 y
5,510
Lugol’s Iodine Free S&H
J.Crow’s® Lugol’s Iodine Solution. Restore lost reserves.
Protozoa, Amoeba, Pin Worms?
Hulda Clark Cleanses
Fast and Painless Constipation Relief
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This is a reply to # 2,112,290
So you can see here is a pic taken now (being 2 days after my last peel). Looks a bit better then it is, have that numbish raw feeling and it seems like the inside of my lip will turn to paste in the morning. Spent most of the day trying to avoid ripping the good skin
on the plus side, its not feeling as dry and cracked
- Re: 3rd time longterm
11 y
5,334
This is a reply to # 2,112,293What foods did your strict diet include? Have you stopped the diet recently?
- Re: 3rd time lees
11 y
5,503
This is a reply to # 2,112,468I was on a completely restrictive diet 30 months ago when I cured it.
Then my diet was organic macrobiotic restricted to very few food (whole grains, veges, white meat, cinnamon & tumeric).
After I cured I went back to a wholegrain diet that was less restrictive. Recently I've relaxed a lot and was including cakes, sweets, chocolate, soft drinks, alcohol, non organic foods - but still a reasonably healthy Diet by western standards.
Now I'm stripping out the Sugar and alcohol to see if that makes a difference. So from a dietary perspective I want to encourage a mild detox while reducing the inflammatory response. The range of foods i have now is restrictive but not nearly how it was 30 months back
Typical diet I'm on now: - (90% organic, not of chinese origin) oats (breakfast), (lunch)rye sourdough with sourcraut and tahini, sushi, piece of fruit, dinner - wholegrain (rye, wheat, rice) or lentils with veges/fish/chicken and spice/apple vinegar/soy sauce, salt. Every so often would have a "treat" (ie not that exciting but something I like) - cheese sandwich, humus/cheese & tomato dip with rice crackers.- Re: 3rd time jsl123
11 y
5,432
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This is a reply to # 2,112,751less so the first time you ever got rid of this you were on some form of anti-biotics but you cant remember the dugs name? and it was for a treatment period of 3 months? did the doctor actually prescribe you this drug the first time becasue he thought ec was a bacterial infection?
Also i very important question for myself while you were cured of ec for the last 2 years or what not were your lips 100% back to normal as in you could eat ice cream, drink beer, go swimming and kiss your wife etc etc.. im just wondering when/if my lips ever get rid of this ec crap if they will go back to complete normality.. also did you use a lipbalm while you were cured on a daily basis?
My problem is this white line/slim that appears on the inner part of the lips.. most people believe its just the boared of the new skin that becomes soaked in salivia.. but im not that convinced.. for me the inner parts has the highest turn over and is most irritated. most normal people dont actually have a layer of skin grow on these position of the lips normally its the same as the inside of your cheeks.. and the outer part of the lips have a very very think layer of skin.. thats normal peoples lips its like out mucousa is irritated so it produces this protection barrier of skin...- Re: 3rd time lees
11 y
5,558
This is a reply to # 2,112,928
two more photo's, to show day 3/4 of the cycle. Looks pretty normal from the front, but its definately heading into a peeling cycle at the back. Can see the new skin coming from behind (not damaged from eating or brushing yet) so will try and take care of it. Started moisturising the front more often with coconut oil, and it makes a huge difference in healing the cracks and keeping them looking nice. I was even tricked into thinking my lips could have gone normal once again. Have some important board meetings coming up which will coincide with the end of this cycle not too sure what I'll do if they scab during that time (can't really afford to look completely crap for those).
JSL - Like the verve "the drugs don't work"... It was 7 years back now and was given everything for probably 4-5 months. The only results was a scab that covered my entire lip (see daniels picture - exactly like that), and a secondary infection from the corticosteriods that meant couldn't walk upright for the next half year.
As far as being cured... it is 100%... icecreams, swimming and kissing no worries... I gave my kids raspberries kisses on a bit too regular basis, played the harmonica (badly), and if I wanted to dunk by head is a vat of beer I wouldn't have thought twice about it. Never used lip balm there was no need and wouldn't touch that junk anyhow.
I know what you mean about the healing, and the skin growing from the back that at first gives you false hope. Look I'm no expert of what it is, the cause, I'm more interested in resolving it. My thoughts are that its internal, the redness and overgrowth is inflammatory reesponse of some sort, and its your bodies way of saying you can't cope with an underlying problem (either toxic overload, an allergic reaction, or one of many other possible causes).
I believe what improved me, was incidental to the symptomatic reaction we have in the lips. For me its diet to detox and reduce inflammation. But I am open to the view that there are other ways that might work but I wouldn't be a guinea pig
Be careful with stuff you use... not saying go off imurin halfway through, just don't jump from one drug to the next and make sure you know the risks
- Re: 3rd time jsl123
11 y
5,465
This is a reply to # 2,112,962yeah i agree imuran is pretty much my last drug im going to throw at me for at least 2 or so years iv been through alot in the past 3 years and i know its definately not good for my longterm health...
lee's can i ask you a bunch of questions and then i wont hassle you anymore... its just so relieveing to actually talk to someone who has cured this and has actually had there lips back to normal..
1. with your ec did you also experience the forcyde spots? im trying to solve if they are part of the condition or not or if they just appear during ec due to irritation. one person claimed during healing their spots dissapeared.
2.did you ever experience this white line that forms especially during talking alot of the inner boareders of ec?
3.when you finally healed did you lips have one last peel and then that was it or did the ec area shrink or did you just wake up one morning and bang the irritation was gone the stinging inflammation etc etc was gone and you just knew your lips were back to normal?
4.do you experience this top middile triangular aera? were for some like myself ec first started to show its head.. and if so did you notice that the colour is darker underneath this part? and if you did, did the darkness dissapear once healed...
5.while with ec if i excercise or play sport i feel like the blood flow causes my lips to become more inflammed and almost like have a heavy pulse.
6.when you lips healed and went back to 100% flexibility.. do the lips heal back like a slight difference almost like a scar heals back or is it literally like you would think nothing was ever wrong with them?
7. my lips burn and sting.. did you experience this and if you did, did it all of a sudden stop at once when the peeling stopped orr? i expect my stinging pain is due to the lips being raw but even when i have build up on and there not fully raw they still sting?
8 moisturizing or leaveing them alone? dudring my treatment my drug is designed to suppress imuune system so slow down cell trun over and decrease inflammation due you think i should keep moist or leae alone. i worry that keeping moist makes the skin fall off and shed quicker then normal
i think that it if you could answer these question that would be great! i guess weve really not got to talk to anyone who has been fully cured before especially not once but twice... i cant believe the guys arent asking you hundreds of questions! i wonder if the condition is triggered by something... or if it is like an auto-immune and it can just come and go as it pleases and actually always sits idle in our bodies... i hope one day i can just have a break of it! its very tireing condition especially for young man like myself in our early 20's its taught me alot. and has defintely changed my views and thoughts on life... from a invinsible upcoming semi professional sports star to a ec suffer it brings you to the bottom of the barrels and test your self belief and endurance... im tired but not broken... if one can get rid of it that means it is cureable- Re: 3rd time lees
11 y
5,171
This is a reply to # 2,113,635hi mate.
1. No foredyce spots.
2. Yep I had the white lines in vermillion. This decrease and goes away before healing.
3. The healing is gradual, I'm taking photo's this time
4. No. My top lip is less badly affected (I always peel it real quick, and if its a problem it tends to white line onto the bottom lip overnight.
5. it does burn when do exercise, esp if its raw. not aware of bloodflow
6. complete healing, as if you never had EC
7. yes burn and sting, especially if I've forced a peel, or my diet is bad. Burning and stinging stage disappears as you move towards healing (ie healing from the inside)
8. I wouldn't moisturise except to remove buildup and prevent craps that split your lips
EC doesn't need to be a burden, just don't make it rule your life... think if you were blind or without a limb you'd accommodate to it... for me EC makes very little difference about how I go about my life
8.
- Re: 3rd time jsl123
11 y
5,269
This is a reply to # 2,115,913hey lees thanks for the reply.. its so strange to hear you talk about it its great almost like your certain your going to heal it again i guess you know how to do it... it seems like the lips go through a stage of thinner crusts, white line and slough becomes less and the colour of lips turns from a reddish colour to a more natural pinkish colour...
also when you say yep you had white lines on vermillion... you do mean the white line of like a sticky whitsh substance that runs along the very inside of the lips almost were the salivia hits the lips? if so thats awesome becasue my white line is definately on the decrease in the last week some days now it doesnt even form and thats a first for me...- Re: 3rd time jsl123
11 y
5,330
This is a reply to # 2,115,918also i would exect during the healing stage for the lips to go through some form of healing like a "scab" i mean the trauma that they get is unbelieveable,,, so a few cycles of thin protective scabbish skin would be expected... i would expect during the last cycles that also the scab turns from a yellowish colour to a more clear colour...
anyways im still not sure exactly what your plan of attack is apart from a little bit of coconut oil and a healthy Diet and gently removeing the dead skin when its ready to fall... what are you exact thoughts on what ec is? you said you were sure you got it this time from biteing your top lip so would that mean its been triggered this time round by trauma and our lips are like super sensitive and this crazy ec cycle happens when they get aggrevate or irritated..
anyways i could talk all day about this till i get rid of it! Lol thanks for your input and please give us a fortnightly update or something we would all really appreciate it!
peace- Re: 3rd time Samwise
11 y
5,242
This is a reply to # 2,115,920Hey lees was wondering what if you happened to look at your tongue at all? white build up at all? teeth indentations (scalloped)?
Also, about the white slimy buildup when you get them wet. When I remove the white slimy gunk when they get wet it seems to make my lips smoother but it doesn't actually peel any skin off it seems, at least not the part that's actually attached to the lips. Why would this be bad to remove?
- Re: 3rd time Samwise
11 y
5,242
- Re: 3rd time jsl123
11 y
5,330
- Re: 3rd time jsl123
11 y
5,269
- Re: 3rd time lees
11 y
5,171
- Re: 3rd time jsl123
11 y
5,465
- Re: 3rd time lees
11 y
5,558
- Re: 3rd time jsl123
11 y
5,432
- Re: 3rd time lees
11 y
5,503
- Re: 3rd time longterm
11 y
5,334
- Re: 3rd time lees
11 y
5,510
- Re: 3rd time lees
11 y
5,378
- Re: 3rd time jsl123
11 y
5,363
- Re: 3rd time Maxime77
11 y
5,521
- Re: 3rd time xbcc
11 y
5,355
- Re: 3rd time lees
11 y
5,412
- Re: 3rd time pitseleh
11 y
5,148
This is a reply to # 2,111,913hey lees, sorry to hear youv got it again, im currently on the candida diet, and my lips have slowed down to peeling every two weeks or so, just wondering if this is what happens when starting to get better?? thank you
- Re: 3rd time Hopeful11
11 y
5,603
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