we would have to push them back a very long way...

this person also stated that the goings on we are so publically witnessing today, the obvious global (big business economy and other governments) running of the show along with manipulation by those we owe money, like China, and the slow erosion of individual rights have been in effect for decades.

His first exposure to this was inside the Eisenhower administration where this same big business\country\creditor manipulation, blackmail, and threats, went on at dinners and catered meetings.

He also stated it has most likely been that way since about the end of Jefferson's term in office... which is probably true as John Adams had levied taxes to build up a navy and army while Jefferson and Burr were apposed to the taxes. The examples we are getting from Jackson's administration in this forum seem to bear that out. We are trying to go up against over 200 years of party variations in ideals, along with corruption, blackmail and big world power manipulation, wheeling and dealing along with the continuing (from the inception of this country) struggle to maintain some sense of states rights.

The whole family he is a part of is voting for McCain for one simple reason... it will slow the move towards socialism and whatever is to follow a bit. In some respects, I agree with him, as it will buy time for what I say next.

I have come to conclusion that change MUST happen from the bottom up... and we have to hope that those put into office stay relatively incorruptible and true to their cause. This means putting people of a similar mind to Ron Paul in local, state, and national congressional offices. These things do not happen overnight... While a Ron Paul, or Baldwin vote sounds good to me, from experience, in my own state, if either one of them took office, their hands would be immediately tied; if they went against the status quo and refused to play the game, congress would do an end around, they would be trumped up on charges real or imagined (the media would make sure we thought whatever the reason at minimum morally wrong; Spitzer), and\or they would be held at bay by the machine around them and be ineffective at best. While in office, anyone going against the status quo was taken out in one way or another... so what control or say does a single voter really have?

With Ron Paul's current efforts in putting like minded people into congressional office, I believe it may have been his intent all along... work from the bottom up.

There are some money bombs coming up for key positions he is trying to get filled... check them out. perhaps there is one in your state.

And then you get into the issue that many people in this country seem to WANT socialism; it can't get here fast enough for them (look at the numbers of those on the dole)... just look at Medicaid\Medicare and Social Security entitlement spending alone having a 100 Trillion in unfunded obligations... and we have not gotten into Food Stamps, Welfare, Child and Adult Protective Services, etc. etc.

"Entitlements" are over half the pie, and those who want socialism want more? What will they be willing to give up for it? The medical system will get worse and we will all be like cattle in a feedlot... among other things, such as a degradation in the quality of food, from its already poor state, and a degradation in the quality and size of the average home.



I am not going to tell you how to vote, but Vote - I would like to state that your vote would be counted fairly... but I do not know that, and I really suspect not.

this quote by him made an impact on me...

"Our country is sinking toward socialism, wealth redistribution is happening, everybody is "guaranteed shelter, food, medical care etc." our parents and us had to work for that stuff, were we stupid?"

No, they were not stupid... they fought for, and voted for the right to work hard and then enjoy the fruits of their labors... and are sad to be witnessing the seemingly rapid change that is affecting their children and grandchildren.

grz-