Date:   1/21/2005 7:28:28 PM ( 19 y ago)
Hits:   9,140
URL:   https://www.curezone.org/forums/fm.asp?i=563284

Nova thnx!

I do admit that sometimes i can be a little harsh when first confronted with something, and i do word-bomb occasionally ;)

It's not Kevin W. i see as possibly having a hidden-agenda... But he may be used by some... i don't know, it's more of a gut feeling... but my gut feeling about things like these has usually proven right :)
so far, that is.

thing is, i do believe there is a secret depopulation going on globally; with so-called aids, tsunamis, so-called natural disasters, and what not. Now, if i were one of the depopulators (i.e. what i called "Nazis"), if i saw that NDE is useful tool in it, i would use it. And i'd look for well-meaning people like K. W., who for whatever reason believe in the right to take one's own life when hardship gets tough, and are willing to promote the idea, to add their obvious honesty to the idea's appeal.

This is of course, doesn't mean this is necessarily the case with near-death.com. But coupled with the strange feelings i had on the site before (see the rest of this thread for deatils), and seeing that it's not one text about suicide, but a pretty comprehensive promotion of euthanasia...

And let me mention that i'm not one of the "folks who'll close down the moment they hear what Kevin's got to say and leave his site altogether" i.e. christian fundamentalist, or a stubborn pro-lifer, or anything like that. On the contrary.

But i think there is a fundamental difference between TAKING one's life, and GIVING one's life, and in my view, only the first kind of death can be called "suicide"; the other is sacrifice.
I don't see this difference emphasized on the site; on the contrary, doing it for others is leveled with doing it because of a pain. Also, site repeatedly mentions Jesus and other heroic figres as examples of "suicide". Now, I think to a confused teenager going through a dark phase - or any depressive person - thinking about suicide, this will give the suicide idea a heroic overtone which may easily add to the good feeling about it.

I was sent a list by Kevin, of "biblical examples of suicides". I guess he thought i must be an agile christian, for objecting to suicide promotion. I am not,a nd i don't take Bible for granted. However, for the sake of argument, I took each and every quote he gave me (luckily with those biblical numerical references), and looked it up in online bible, and found out that they all belonged to one of three cases:

1. Herioc deeds, sacruifices (like Jesus and Samson) - hence shouldn't be called suicides

2. Persons asking God to take their life, in which case God would ALWAYS encourage them to live instead

3. Successfully commited suicides, sometimes of already troubled personalities, about whose DE aftermath or God's evaluation of their act nothing is said, so they can't be used as examples of "ok suicides".


To my remark about this and other his examples of what he called suicides, he said in mail to me:

'And even if they did it merely for "selfish" reasons alone, nobody is in a position to declare that what they did was "wrong" or "a sin" or a "crime" or "unethical"'

Now, crime is a matter of law, sin is of faith, but taking one's life for selfish reasons IS "wrong" towards other people, and therefore "unethical". Ethics didn't dissapear from earth and souls with 21st century. There is still right and wrong.

And anyway, that's only part of the problem. From what i've seen in NDE's that sound genuine enough to me (again, see the rest of the thread) and not hollywood-like A-production NDEs, suiciders seem to be painfully "chained to consequences of their actions", as George Riche puts it. And i feel that the site in question might be an instrumental - willingly or unwillingly, knowingly or unknowingly, by plan or by accident - in encouraging more people into an act so disastrous for their souls.

And the reason i'm mentioning Nazis and CIA is because i can see how this approach fits into "their" ideas and plans, together with much of what is called New Age nowadays; fake NDE accounts and "honored researchers", about which this thread originally is, included...


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Nova thnx!

I do admit that sometimes i can be a little harsh when first confronted with something, and i do word-bomb occasionally ;)

It's not Kevin W. i see as possibly having a hidden-agenda... But he may be used by some... i don't know, it's more of a gut feeling... but my gut feeling about things like these has usually proven right :)
so far, that is.

thing is, i do believe there is a secret depopulation going on globally; with so-called aids, tsunamis, so-called natural disasters, and what not. Now, if i were one of the depopulators (i.e. what i called "Nazis"), if i saw that NDE is useful tool in it, i would use it. And i'd look for well-meaning people like K. W., who for whatever reason believe in the right to take one's own life when hardship gets tough, and are willing to promote the idea, to add their obvious honesty to the idea's appeal.

This is of course, doesn't mean this is necessarily the case with near-death.com. But coupled with the strange feelings i had on the site before (see the rest of this thread for deatils), and seeing that it's not one text about suicide, but a pretty comprehensive promotion of euthanasia...

And let me mention that i'm not one of the "folks who'll close down the moment they hear what Kevin's got to say and leave his site altogether" i.e. christian fundamentalist, or a stubborn pro-lifer, or anything like that. On the contrary.

But i think there is a fundamental difference between TAKING one's life, and GIVING one's life, and in my view, only the first kind of death can be called "suicide"; the other is sacrifice.
I don't see this difference emphasized on the site; on the contrary, doing it for others is leveled with doing it because of a pain. Also, Kevin Williams repeatedly takes Jesus as an example of "suicide".

To my remark about this and other his examples of what he called suicides, he said in mail to me:

'And even if they did it merely for "selfish" reasons alone, nobody is in a position to declare that what they did was "wrong" or "a sin" or a "crime" or "unethical"'

Now, crime is a matter of law, sin is of faith, but taking one's life for selfish reasons IS "wrong" towards other people, and therefore "unethical". Ethics didn't dissapear from earth and souls with 21st century. There is still right and wrong.

And anyway, that's only part of the problem. From what i've seen in NDE's that sound genuine enough to me (again, see the rest of the thread) and not hollywood-like A-production NDEs, suiciders seem to be painfully "chained to consequences of their actions", as George Riche puts it. And i feel that the site in question might be an instrumental - willingly or unwillingly, knowingly or unknowingly, by plan or by accident - in encouraging more people into an act so disastrous for their souls.

And the reason i'm mentioning Nazis and CIA is because i can see how this approach fits into "their" ideas and plans, together with much of what is called New Age nowadays; fake NDE accounts and "honored researchers", about which this thread originally is, included...


 

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