Date:   10/27/2015 8:31:25 AM ( 10 y ago)
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URL:   https://www.curezone.org/forums/fm.asp?i=2284573

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I know we are all searching for solidarity on this subject matter. If I'm not mistaken, we all agree that not all of the people involved in many of these groups are being led by the Holy Spirit in the manner we understand the Holy Spirit to work. However we all differ on whether all pentecostals/chrismatics are just as guilty. Mainly those that do not stand up and take a stronger stand against what we are discussing here.

Being a denominational church going person that I am. Am I going to be accused of being pro-abortion, or pro-gay marriage or anti-active in Truth because some similar denominational churches choose to go the wrong direction? I hope I will not be grouped in with them, but probably will be. Of course that is just the problem of man misrepresenting me. God knows my heart and that is all that matters. I think we are wanting Ed to show more grief and a desire to fast and pray for these people instead of his cavalier attitude about it all. I don't know Ed all that well and don't know if it's just his personality of not fretting over it like we do, or that he is just in protection mode of his other charismatic beliefs that are being addressed at the same time.

Personally I think Ed is pro many of the NAR beliefs...but maybe not all. That is why he was asking me which one's did I not agree with. (even though I never answered) Well it's too difficult to answer in a group like this. I do believe that the kingdom of God lives within us and that we should be living our lives as though we are expecting Jesus to show up any day to lead us into perfect victory. However, by saying such a thing can be misunderstood. NAR takes that belief too far. They are wanting to be that perfect kingdom now in a fallen world..without Jesus actually being here. I don't believe that is possible unless every human being turns to Christ. We should all live a Christ centered live and do good things in the world and lead others to Christ until He comes. So as you can see, I have a hard time answering these deeper questions because in some ways I agree with some parts of the concept but not to the extreme like they do.

For example, someone asked my opinion about Ted Cruz and I didn't know how to answer them because I had to tell them that I was waiting to see if he was falling head-long into NAR, or was just rubbing elbows due to politics. I want my politicians to be Christ centered and do good in the world...but I can't say I want anyone dominating the world for Christ. Only Christ alone can do that. Now that is where the rub in spirituality can clash among people. Some people believe Jesus is returning in His new glorified body to rule and reign and others believe that He is already here...living in us in Spirit form. So in their minds, there is no reason not to dominate the world in Christ's name now. So there are huge thought differences all the way around.

This is very complicated and I do believe Satan wants it to be this way, but we do have to be careful to not be too black and white here because then we start accusing people who are just not aware because they are in the grey area right now. I do worry about NAR because it is neither a church, nor an organization...it's something in between and that can be very dangerous because you can't hold anyone accountable. So yes, you and I are both very concerned about this NAR group, but I realize that many Charismatic/pentecostals are going to be lumped into it all and may not be in agreement. Most of the pentecostals I talk to have never even heard of NAR, any more than many of us non-pentecostals have. So I do believe the word needs to get out there so they will discover the truth, but we have to be careful how we present it. If you attack all the other issues of their beliefs that you disagree with...then they are going to only debate you and over look the main point you should be making....sticking to the NAR issue. You can not debate the speaking in tongues and healing issues at the same time...they will just tune you out. I know you believe that it's the whole reason why NAR even came into existence because you believe the whole Charismatic church starts off with wrong doctrine and it only goes down hill from there. I disagree with you on some issues about Charismatics/Pentecostals (I'm somewhere in between the two beliefs)and wish you would just stick to the NAR issue. Perhaps you can not separate them? I don't know.

That being said...I don't have an opinion of whether there is still an office of prophet or healer. I just believe that we have the Holy Spirit working within us and we can pray for one another...and our church Elders can pray as well. So I believe in just a different variation of some of these things. If a person believes that God has sent them into a healing ministry...I'm all for it. Some people just focus on that more than other things. Just like some people focus on feeding the hungry...but show less focus on healing. Each person must hear from God and go into each one's ministry. We are not to criticize and compare each others gifts. If Ed can pray for people and they feel better...I'm all for it. If he is not gifted in helping people feel better...well, time would tell. My grand kids tell me my hugs and kisses make them feel healed and all better. I'm apparently gifted. :)

Now if Ed had a different spirit than the Holy Spirit that would be an issue. The question is...How wrong can you be in doctrine and still retain the Holy Spirit? Or in your personal belief system...how can you ever start out with the Holy Spirit and still be wrong? It's human nature to believe we are "right" in our beliefs...or we would never believe the way we do. However, I believe we are all wrong in some ways and right in others. Unless a person is not truly seeking Jesus, would we find someone not covered by grace in such a situation. As we have discovered, we all understand the bible a little different and so are not going to see eye to eye. We all have so much to learn.

I suggest we keep watching the NAR and commenting on it and at least let people be aware. However, it may also draw more people to it. You never know. People are desperate these days and want to see Christian living come back and take it's place in this world because it looks like we are losing ground in so many areas.

The good news is as Christians we know how this is suppose to all end...it has a glorious ending. Or should I say...glorious eternity. :)
 

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