Date:   9/20/2012 2:32:06 PM ( 12 y ago)
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URL:   https://www.curezone.org/forums/fm.asp?i=1987714

-------See 2012 oct edit below before taking action on this message-------------- Took me some longer time to get to your reply- as far as I'm aware, Curezone doesn't send email notifications out (growr). I looked up mangesium and pounding heart on google, and here's the material of interest: http://www.ithyroid.com/latest_ideas.htm Covers the mineral balances needed for hypothyroid issues. 'My latest hair analysis showed very low potassium levels but I ignored this evidence. While my high heart rate days of hyperthyroidism have been long gone, I started experiencing periods of very slow pounding heart rate at night. I attempted to use magnesium and copper to try to control this, and sometimes it would help. However, I reached a point where magnesium and copper only made the situation worse. In fact everything made it worse and I was at a complete loss about what might be causing those symptoms. Finally, the symptoms got so severe that I was getting that "maybe I'm going to die feeling." One night about 3 am when I awoke with muscle cramping, severe heart problems, and I could hardly walk, I decided I had to try something that I wasn't supplementing. For some reason I tried potassium and within 20 minutes the symptoms were substantially less and within an hour I was comfortably back to sleep. Over the next two weeks, continuing potassium supplementation completely eliminated all of those heart symptoms. Another reminder that no matter how bleak a health situation might seem, when you get the right nutrient you can recover in minutes. As I've experimented with potassium I have developed a first rule that you may want to check out for yourself: If you feel your heart rate pounding at a high rate, reach for magnesium first. If you feel your heart rate pounding at a low rate, reach for potassium first. The ratio of potassium to magnesium seems to be important. If we need a minimum daily intake of 2500 mgs of potassium and 400 mgs of magnesium to maintain health, then perhaps a ratio of 6:1 might be appropriate. This seems high to me, but I have very little information to go by. My gut feeling is that for supplementation, it might be best to take between a 1:1 and a 2:1 ratio of potassium to magnesium. For example, try 400-800 mgs of potassium and 400 mgs of magnesium if you're experiencing pounding heart rate problems (adjust the ratio depending on whether it's a high or low heart rate). Remember to factor in your dietary intake of these minerals since the potassium content of foods can be high (450 mgs for a banana). Persons with hyperthyroidism who want to try potassium supplementation should proceed with caution. Try a small amount and increase very gradually, making sure to take copper and magnesium as needed.' (from the above link) 'I think that it's worthwhile experimenting with potassium to see what effects it might have. Remember, that potassium itself is not going to relieve the major symptoms of thyroid disease--it just opens the cellular door for the important minerals to get in so they can perform their duties. Used in conjunction with the other recommended nutrients, additional potassium from supplementation or eating extra amounts of high potassium foods like potatoes and bananas may be a key in recovery. For those who have experienced weight gain or edema, watch your weight and other symptoms. I found that when I was potassium deficient, at night when I removed my socks I saw noticeable indentation marks where my socks were. Above the sock line, my legs seemed swollen. So far, getting extra potassium has significantly reduced that symptom.' (also from the above link) http://bigvits.co.uk/product.asp?pid=336&bid=5 NOW foods thyroid energy was a supplement I was considering trying about five months ago when I was planning this year's purchases for experimenting, though I didn't go after it this time around, having a very reduced food budget for the past few months. The reviews on the above products page is positive, but the supplement ingredient list is telling in this case of talking about supplements, and if you compare it with the ithyroid link above (scroll to the top of this post) you can get an idea of the balances needed. http://askville.amazon.com/boiling-potatoes-leach-potassium-putting-refrigerator-overnight/AnswerViewer.do?requestId=5518913 Gives a good idea of the best foods to indulge in to up your potassium levels to test this out. How effective has your vitamin D supplementation been? What were your blood levels before you started, what are they currently after continuing supplementation, and what are your targets with your doctor? (include information on what the measurement type is, there is one scale used in Europe, and one in the states). Vitamin D absorbtion is effected by several factors- prescription medications (a reliable list can be found here), VDR (vitamin D receptor sites in the genetic level) site mutations, and co-Q10/ Ubiquinol status. The co-Q10/Ubiquitinol and vitamin D relationship is one that was reported on the vitamin D council facebook web page about six months back, and explains why some folk up in age have difficulty in upping their vitamin D status. Supplementing with the active form of Co Q 10 (Ubiquinol) helps up vitamin D3 levels much faster for folk who find that they have to take higher and higher levels of Vitamin D to help keep their hydroxy-vitamin-d blood levels up. (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Coenzyme_Q10) "This oil-soluble, vitamin-like substance is present in most eukaryotic cells, primarily in the mitochondria. It is a component of the electron transport chain and participates in aerobic cellular respiration, generating energy in the form of ATP. Ninety-five percent of the human body’s energy is generated this way.[1][2] Therefore, those organs with the highest energy requirements—such as the heart, liver and kidney—have the highest CoQ10 concentrations.[3][4][5] There are three redox states of coenzyme Q10: fully oxidized (ubiquinone), semiquinone (ubisemiquinone), and fully reduced (ubiquinol). The capacity of this molecule to exist in a completely oxidized form and a completely reduced form enables it to perform its functions in the electron transport chain and as an antioxidant respectively." (Wikipedia) Cq1o and Ubiquitinol are expensive supplements, respectively- Ubiquitinol nearing the level used by a doctor investigating the vitamin D3 and Cq10/Ubiquitinol relationship used 400 mg of ubiquitinol for about 4 months and saw his vitamin D3 blood levels rise and stabilize quite well (he was observing a study of it's uses for elderly patiets, I think with alzheimer's). This level would be rather heavy in cost to achieve, because Ubi(blablabla) is refied from red meat organ tissue (I believe). For example, ' Healthy Origins Ubiquinol (Kaneka QH™) 200mg 150s $159.99 ' is the price listed by the producer I use for my vitamin D3 supplements when I buy from the states. Ideally checking your mineral balances is the way to go, besides considering your diet. Are you on any prescription medications for your hypothyroidisim or osteoperosis? What other supplements and medications are you on (OTC meds count too)? My husband notes to give you an important caution - heart palpitations and effects are something you need to investigate quite carefully, especially around mineral, sodium and nutrient balances. Printing out our dialogue will likely help your doctor understand your thoughts and supplement choices, and help him to guide you properly through the maze on your way. Considering what you tell me with borderline osteoperosis a low vitamin D level, and heart pounding (heavy heartbeat, right, slow, as if it's struggling? ) it looks like a straight up calcium absorbtion issue, and CoQ10 (you'd need a higher dosage) or Ubiquitinol (active form. but more effective) may be an important part of your puzzle. In this order: Cq10/Ubiquitinol -> helping absorbtion and utilization of Vit D3 -> increasing absorbtion of calcium -> Vit D3, low magnesium and higher calcium working together to help in the bones. A sidetrail I want to track down are the effects of mercury in-vitro on magnesium, calcium and potassium levels, for personal reasons. Tell me, are you a smoker, what have been your lifestyle habits for the past ten to twenty years, have you had dental fillings of the silver type, and what fat percentage are we working with in your case? Gender is usually Female in cases of hypothyroidisim and osteoperosis, so I'm assuming that's the case, but low vit D status explains itself as to how it usually comes about. A Vitamin D receptor site test might help point out if your issue is down to genetics. I cannot say how common this is, I'd have to ask the practicing doctors on the VitD facebook page (Heck, you could do that too) ;) Hmm.. Learn to eat beef heart and potatoes? >;) heart is rather tasty if you cook it properly! Here: A google translation of a danish recipie for calve's hearts in a cream sauce with potatoes. Organ meat is rich in iron and potentially Cq10, and when you have the patience to boil your calf-heart slices for 3-4 hours, you'd be amazed at how tender and good the meat is! Potatoes are also very good sources of potatssium, (especially sweet potatoes), and iron is vital to using energy in the body (one of the main ingredients in creating red blood cells in the marrow). Go for fresh potatoes. Do I need to even say drink milk? Mhgrhgr. Some folk on this site are anti-dairy because of the broken-down components of the drink are potentially health-hazardous, but things such as continual colds, runny noses, allergies and the like have links to low vitamin D status as well. When it comes down the line to iron and energy levels, vitamin C is vital in the formation and maintenance of bone and joint health, and it regulates the intake of iron. Grapefruit juice, orange juice, kiwis or supplemental C in your morning regiment is ideal, before you go on to mineral-heavy foods or supplements. You still have a lot of puzzle-solving work to do, TBH, but hopefully these can be some helpful informations. Report back. Your actual D level, your weight and muscle mass level vs fat level, your supplement regime and prescription medication (current and past), How much vitamin D you've been talking, for how long, and any effects it has. Myah. _____________2012 Oct edit_______________ The danish recipie for calves' hearts in cream is a bad idea. Calcium inhibits protien metabolisim, and will likely interfere with your uptake of coQ10/Ubiquitinol. For osteoperosis, Nattokinkase/Vitamin K2/MK7 (Non-alfalfa source) is the way to go after a month of Uquiquinol (I'd say 100 mg.) Calcium also messes with iron and cobalt absorbtion (cobalamin). Your milk source is best from hard cheese or organic yogurt, but a high-dairy diet will get in your way almost all around. The danish recipie for calves' hearts in cream is a bad idea. Calcium inhibits protien metabolisim, and will likely interfere with your uptake of coQ10/Ubiquitinol. For osteoperosis, Nattokinkase/Vitamin K2/MK7 (Non-alfalfa source) is the way to go after a month of Uquiquinol (I'd say 100 mg.) Calcium also messes with iron and cobalt absorbtion (cobalamin). Your milk source is best from hard cheese or organic yogurt, but a high-dairy diet will get in your way almost all around.
 

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