Date:   5/2/2010 9:37:15 PM ( 14 y ago)
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URL:   https://www.curezone.org/forums/fm.asp?i=1616372

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I really do not know what to say. If you were standing in front of me, part of me would want to ask you to step outside. Yet there is another part of me that just has deep sorrow for you

Vektek and I have time after time tried to give the passages that show that the law is a curse. And that anyone who tries to live by them is cursed. You take it further and make up new laws to curse yourself with. We have tried to show that we are all sinners. I have not seen anyone claiming to be good. Everyone here is saying that the only good we have is that the spirit is living in us and guiding our steps. That is everyone but you. You have it together so much that you even keep all your new rules flawlessly and impose them on everyone else. Just like judaizers did the gentiles. It was so bad Paul had to write a letter to the church in Galatia to deal with the damage being done.

So I am going to be Paul to you for a second. I am going forget you are trying to cut down my wife as well as her friend Doc and be as civil as I can.

In 1525 one of my favorite books was published. It was called Bondage of the will. 

I would like to start with a few excerpts

"the commandments are not given inappropriately or pointlessly; but in order that through them the proud, blind man may learn the plague of his impotence, should he try to do as he is commanded." pg. 160


"I say that man without the grace of God nonetheless remains the general omnipotence of God who effects, and moves and impels all things in a necessary, infallible course; but the effect of man's being carried along is nothing--that is, avails nothing in God's sight, nor is reckoned to be anything but sin. 265


I say that man, before he is renewed into the new creation of the Spirit's kingdom, does and endeavours nothing to prepare himself for that new creation and kingdom, and when he is re-created has does and endeavors nothing towards his perseverance in that kingdom; but the Spirit alone works both blessings in us, regenerating us, and preserving us when regenerate, without ourselves..." 268



Moreless, I  mean Monkeytime no matter what you do, and how good you think you are living you are forgetting Isaiah 64:6

But we are all as an unclean thing, and all our righteousnesses are as filthy rags; and we all do fade as a leaf; and our iniquities, like the wind, have taken us away.

Most translations translate this as "polluted garment" applying hermeneutics shows us it should more properly be translated as something else in the English language. This still does not do justice to how the Jews felt about ritual uncleanness.

So this how God views our righteousness.

I am so glad I am not thinking about the law or other rules, but am instead submitting myself to his grace.

Paul's letter to the Romans was amazing. Letting us know that it is not us but Christ that works everything in us.


I would like to challenge you to read the entire book of Romans over a few evenings.

I also would like to challenge you to put all of the Herbert Armstrong stuff aside for a bit and look at a good quality systematic theology course

There is a great one here

There is just too much Biblical evidence showing that God causes suffering. I think it is pure arrogance to think that human men some how have something to do with it and can control it.

Lets look at Job Chapter 1 again

6 Now there was a day when the sons of God came to present themselves before the LORD, and Satan also came among them. 7 The LORD said to Satan, From where have you come? Satan answered the LORD and said, From going to and fro on the earth, and from walking up and down on it. 8 And the LORD said to Satan, Have you considered my servant Job, that there is none like him on the earth, a blameless and upright man, who fears God and turns away from evil?

God threw Job under the bus

His friends sounded a lot like you. Asking him what his sin was. Because God would not do this to anyone unless they had gross sin, right?

They ignored God's sovereignty, and that God was doing this because he wanted to. That was it. He just wanted to.

I am done, but I want you to stop ripping on people who are sick and saying to them that they are not doing enough to be well. Because they might just be another Job and you may be another Eliphaz, Bildad, or Zophar. How about you just say "man that must be hard, Let me pray with you" 

This is what I do for my wife everyday

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