Date:   12/14/2009 10:42:20 AM ( 15 y ago)
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URL:   https://www.curezone.org/forums/fm.asp?i=1539316

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I find what you have conveyed to be an example of massive filtration from within a perceptual vantage point. Lots of assumptions there.
I would wager a bet that given a sampling of x amount of people that each one would have a different interpretation of my debating style and all the information shared. That is one of my core messages after all. You are helping me demonstrate it. -With this last statement I have no disagreement there are as many interpretations of a situation as there are minds that are capable of viewing it. 

You are assuming that my experience is taken from books. I would, based on that supposition, guess that you have not considered infinite potential as the container that all other beliefs fit into, including books. What I am saying is that - yes, your experience is 'yours' when it comes out of you living your life. I would not call it an 'experience' when it has been derived out of reading something in a book and it has not yet been implemented through living one's life. Then it simply remains a concept, a belief.

It is easy to 'believe' something is one's own experience without having to actually having done the 'work' of integrating it into one's own life. Many are doing so. Its like trying to take short cuts through life. But all one really accomplishes by doing so is to short change oneself. Avoiding life in exchange for accumulating knowledge, is short changing oneself - which is really no change at all.  If the understanding really comes out of your own life experience then you would have something to share. But often times, in what is said, in the way that it is said, it reveals that it is not something that is being shared at all. On the contrary, it is obvious, it is something that, in a way, is being attempted to be shoved it done the throats of others, an imposition. In this regard, yes, imposition will be met by others with great opposition. This is basic to human psychology. This is not assumption.

From your side - it is an assumption that I have made based on what you have said. From my side, it is what is being observed. As I have said in my above post, it seems to me that the term "infinite potential" is another word for the word 'God'. If you have gotten this idea from book, then what is the difference between one book and another book? ...Between the Koran, the Bible, Talmud and other books - others you have read? Are they not all but scripture? Deriving ideas, notions, beliefs, from a second hand source? I am not opposed to using other ways of trying to label that which cannot be put into words - choose one and call it what you like - God, Allah, Infinte Potential, Truth, Love, Nirvana, Samadhi, Oneness, Self, No-Self, No-thing-ness, the Absolute, Existence, Right Mindedness, Mindfulness, No-Mind, Atman, Anatta, Moksha, Freedom, Liberation, Salvation, etc., etc., etc. - but by saying that it can only be expressed by others in the terms that you choose to use, then you are just limiting the conversation, narrowing the playing field. Your so-called 'infinite potential' has then become quite limited. Kind of cutting off one's nose, here, it seems to me. In your saying that 'infinite potential' is a 'container' "that all other beliefs fit into, including books" then you have only defined it as a 'belief' that contains all other beliefs. The mind with its infinite number of doors... Caves within a cave.  

When I come up against incoherent belief systems where there is a kind of cutting one's nose off to spite it's face within the information, I point it out in places like Debate Forums where it is the venue to do so. If this is taken as "pushing ideas," I would point you back to yourself as you too have now entered the "ring" of pushing yours. If it were really coming out of your experience, then there would not be any need to argue, debate about it, to try to convince others of 'your way' is the only way to grow into this life. There would be no need to enter into debate forums, attempting to put others right, to dismantle all other "incoherent belief systems". If you really were presently experiencing the 'infinite potential' within yourself then your words would resonate with this understanding. There would be no need to come here at all... Instead, others would come to you, others would be seeking you out - 'incoherent belief systems' would simply dissolve away in the process, under the brilliant light of your "Infinite Potential".  Before you came across your "infinite potential" were you not also lost at a time before this? Were you not also immersed within a conditioning, a hypnosis, a programming of some kind? Were you not also less aware than you are now?  

To understand and relate to others that have an 'incoherent belief system' going on for themselves, it seems to me, that if one would have to have gone through the whole process of getting lost and then finding the way of it for oneself. Then, seems to me, that one would be able to emphathize better with others, more than what I have observed happening here, thus far. 

I enjoy many styles of "persuasion" and enjoy shifting between them. -As any good philosopher, pundit, scholar, man of knowledge, would enjoy doing... the playing word games. But I still would not call it 'styles of persuasion', I would call it more appropriately what it is - 'methods of argumentation'.

 Cheers - turiya

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