Date:   4/22/2009 1:00:52 AM ( 15 y ago)
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URL:   https://www.curezone.org/forums/fm.asp?i=1402492

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 "“Acid rain isn’t just a problem of the land; it’s also affecting the ocean,” 

Acid rain has been a fact of life even long before man arrived on this earth. How do you think the oceans have become so salty? It is the acids formed by the reaction of rainwater on nitrogen and sulfur oxides, and other natural acids, that dissolve rock, which in turn makes its way in to the oceans. The minerals do not evaporate leading to an increased concentration of salts. Other acids include those formed from the reaction of water with gasses, from volcanoes for example, that also form acid rain.

excess nitrogen inputs from the atmosphere promote increased growth of phytoplankton and other marine plants which, in turn, may cause more frequent harmful algal blooms and eutrophication (the creation of oxygen-depleted “dead zones”) in some parts of the ocean.

As I already pointed out.

This rain of chemicals changes the chemistry of seawater, with the increase in acidic compounds lowering the pH of the water while reducing the capacity of the upper ocean to store carbon.

Again, why do we have coral? Even with lakes in New York that have become very acidic from acid rain this whole process took a very long time as the natural acidic buffers in the lake and surrounding soil had to be depleted before the pH could become acidic in the lakes. The ocean is no different. In order to become acidic the natural buffers must first be used up to allow acidification. This includes all of the corals, the coral sand, the seashells..........

The most heavily affected areas tend to be downwind of power plants (particularly coal-fired plants) and predominantly on the eastern edges of North America, Europe, and south and east of Asia.

Seawater is slightly basic (pH usually between 7.5 and 8.4), but the ocean surface is already 0.1 pH units lower than it was before the Industrial Revolution. Previous research by Doney and others has suggested that the ocean will become another 0.3 to 0.4 pH units lower by the end of the century, which translates to a 100 to 150 percent increase in acidity."

So he really thinks that all seawater has the same pH? So the colder kelp laden waters he mentions in most of the places he mentions will have the same pH as warmer coral bearing waters? And the water does not circulate mixing the acidic waters with more alkaline waters from higher carbonate concentrations? And according to your hero Moreless oxygen reduces acidity. So wave action among other things that help to oxygenate water is not buffering the acids. Oh, could Moreless be wrong? Could it be so simple?

I wrote a paper on this issue almost 20 years ago...

BTW - the polite reference to CO2 being the "big" culprit here has to do with the politics of Science and political appeasement... not truth.

the coral reefs ARE dissolving...

read up what happens when a reef tank becomes just slightly more acidic than it should...

An aquarium is not the same as the ocean. I happen to do a lot of diving. I have yet to see any evidence of coral reefs dissolving or shells, or urchin exoskeletons, or anything else calcium based in the oceans. In fact while diving in Hawaii I saw a lot of coral. I also dove dead zones in both Hawaii and the Florida Keys. In both cases the coral was completely dead and the water cloudy and discolored. Yet the corals were not dissolved, nor did they have any signs of being dissolved.

"The shells of coral and other marine life dissolve in acid. The process is happening so fast that many such species, including coral, crabs, oysters and mussels, may become unable to build and repair their shells and will die out, say the researchers."

Apparently these "researchers" do not dive and have not really checked out this hypothesis. I can show you all sorts of shells that I have collected from diving all over. Most of the shells are extremely thick. Same goes for the sheep crabs I have caught. You need a hammer to break their claws open because they are so thick.

There are tons of references to shell fish losing the ability to form and maintain their shells... and in cases where they have one, the shell is considerably thinner...

This link is interesting being that their shells require carbon dioxide to form. Do you know how coral forms for example? As fish repirate they release carbon dioxide in to the water. This reacts with calcium in the water forming calcium carbonate. The calcium carbonate is picked up by polyps that they use to cement themselves to a hard surface. As the polyps die other polyps cement themselves to the older polyps with the calcium carbonate. Shells of snails, exoskeletons of urchins, etc. form in a similar way. Then there is the factor of seaweeds and phytoplankton that also use up a lot of the CO₂, nitrates and sulfates.

Current evidence shows that acidity is destroying the shells of tiny organisms that help absorb enormous amounts of carbon pollution from the atmosphere.

You mean phytoplankton? The same phytoplankton that are supposedly creating large blooms and killing off the corals? But wait, if the phytoplankton are being killed off then how are they creating massive blooms to kill off the corals. Sounds to me like you and Moreless are coming up with contradictory stories.

The Guardian reports that growing acidity is already placing pressure on shellfish and other marine life in the Artic and Antarctic.

The Guardian? What scientific journal is that? Or is this another one of those Chicken Little publications?

High application rates of inorganic nitrogen fertilizers in order to maximize crop yields combined with the high solubilities of these fertilizers leads to increased leaching of nitrates into groundwater. Eventually, nitrate-enriched groundwater makes its way into lakes, bays and oceans where it accelerates the growth of algae, disrupts the normal functioning of water ecosystems and kills fish, a process known as eutrophication. Water may become cloudy and/or discolored (green, yellow, brown, or red). About half of all the lakes in the United States are eutrophic, while the number of oceanic dead zones near inhabited coastlines are increasing.

Again, something I already pointed out. Of course this is a separate issue than acidification

Instead of flatly denying or accusing ML of false statements in every single post he makes, you would do well to research a bit first.

I guess I could say the same for you as you have yet to prove anything about acidity causing these dead zones from algae blooms. In fact as I pointed out your statements were contradictory. The acids are killing the phytoplankton, but these phytoplankton are not really dying as they are creating massive algae blooms that are killing the corals. You can't have it both ways so one or both of your statements was incorrect.

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