Date:   4/2/2009 10:23:21 AM ( 15 y ago)
Hits:   1,864
URL:   https://www.curezone.org/forums/fm.asp?i=1387959

Hi Sara,

I have my neighbours cat visit me, cos he likes me. The best of both worlds, a cat without the responsibility, he he! And yes, Willowley is good at dealing with self esteem issues. And I agree the ultimate goal should be perfection. Why settle for less. At least aim for it.

Now, here's a few thoughts I have been getting together. It's a little off topic from the original post. I am just experimenting with some ideas here.

Going back to my original post, if person A and person B agree that something is good / bad, (eg catching an animal in the Pleasure Trap example is good) then the status mechanism will work and status will be duly rewarded on success. However if person A and B do not agree (eating burgers are OK / Not OK), then it doesn't work.

Now, those who read the Pleasure Trap, will realise realise that our primary objectives are to eat and reproduce. Therefore getting food is good, getting eaten by a bear or falling off a cliff is bad.

I think what has happened with this world is that we have lost touch with our roots. Nowadays having the money to buy a new car seems attractive, and a big house. That sounds OK, BUT, and it is a big but... the way we are living is not sustainable. If what I have read is true, then we will reach peak oil soon, now or 2013 is one estimate, then oil will decline at 2-3% per year until it runs out. We are currently burning oil 100 times faster than it is being created, and demand is getting greater.

What will that mean? In short, chaos. You can get some idea by looking up Cuba Special Period. The average Cuban lost 20 pounds after 1991, when the Soviet block collapsed. They had no oil to power tractors to harvest crops, people didn't know how to use oxen, and older farmers had to be brought out of retirement to teach younger ones how to use them. No fertiliser either, it was made from oil. The Cubans survived by improvising, and planting organic gardens, even on rooftops.

As this video points out http://video.google.co.uk/videoplay?docid=4152340418943461860&hl=en
the UK here is a net food importer, and we only have 150,000 farmers average age 60. They don't have the physical strength to farm manually, let alone the knowledge. The soil has been killed by years of intensive farming, and it will take many years (40+?) to restore it. Farming is all but dead in the UK.

So in a few years, I think people are going to get a harsh reality check, as did the Cubans, but on a bigger scale. With 10 billion people trying to survive, I think people's perceptions of what is good and what is bad will change. A concreted garden may not seem such a good idea when the price of food is rocketing and getting scarce, along with the means to transport it from a farm to a city (assuming the farmers get round all the problems they themselves will face).

It's at that point I think person A and person B be more united in what they think is good, since a fast food meal will probably not be an option (animal farming is hugely inefficient). Things that are perceived as good by some people are not always good for the planet and can't sustain life. Therein lies the problem. People need to make the link - what's bad for the planet is bad for me.

I would imagine people that grow food have high status in Cuba, just like the successful hunter did in the original post, as they can help facilitate the eat and reproduce cycle.

Back to basics, as it were.
 

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