Date:   12/9/2007 11:37:32 PM ( 17 y ago)
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URL:   https://www.curezone.org/forums/fm.asp?i=1059398

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1770's is a bit of an exaggeration... in most of Paul's discussions and thoughts, he realistically states fiscally bringing Government back to 1995 - 2000 spending levels. I doubt in one term, even with congressional support, if this much of a rollback is feasible.

He is fully aware that change as he is proposing will never happen in a single term Presidency.

I sure would like to know where Molly got her strong feelings from and would very much appreciate a post in the political debate forum that would support her feelings.
Her post, may or may not get others to think... at a minimum about how we got to where we are today.

I know that most today do not blame themselves, nor do they accept responsibility for it, but consider themselves victims. This line of thinking, is in large part, the biggest problem. Whether we feel we are the victims of others or not, whether we blame others such as, our governmnet, choices of others, our parents, grandparents, whomever, it is time to stop passing the buck and realize that we must collectively, as Americans, accept responsibility for this country and its current state of affairs.

My son did two tours in Iraq on the front lines... lead platoons of marines into many days long firefights and he has lost friends, close friends; he has also seen the ugly side of war... civilian casualties, etc. He was recently called up from reserves and is serving again as a company commander. It all has profoundly changed him. While I strongly support him and his troops, have sent literally hundreds of pounds of care packages and hundreds of support letters, I have always been against the military action...

I do know that some are strongly apposed to Dr. Paul's immigration stance... others have become so dependent upon government entitlement programs, and/or are looking toward the day when they will get "theirs" (they are "owed" and deserve it don't ya know because they have been paying into it; even if they are oblivious to, or just do not care that the working class and their children and grandchildren are having to increasingly pay the uncontrollable rising tab) that it is a security blanket to look forward too... they are afraid with a Ron Paul in office that they will not "get theirs"... I have news for those folks. The entitlements may not last long no matter who gets into office... another candidate may make promises of universal medical care, etc. etc. but it is already a well known fact that we cannot afford the programs we do have. The recent mortgage lending bailout is another HUGE governmental, unaffordable, financial mistake... Who will pay? You and I are paying right now with a depreciating dollar; money stolen from us to pay for other's (for the most part, the rich) greed. Smoke and mirrors may buffer the fall a bit and make us feel a sigh of relief on occasion, but the bill must be paid in full some day. There are already so many unfunded entitlements and mandates that obligations cannot be met... what are they thinking?

Government is already defaulting on entitlement promises... Do not believe it? Ask the government evicted post New Orleans Katrina victims... the tit has run dry for them and it is just a matter of time for others.

As illustrated above, if one is currently receiving and dependent upon entitlements now, I can understand their concern with a Ron Paul win... but our current habits and government places our children, and our born and unborn grandchildren into ever deeper debt with each passing minute that this madness continues, at the same time, dramatically reducing our future standard of living... heck, most people today have already seen their standard of living fall well below their parents before them... some grandparents have their adult children living with them and/or are raising their grandchildren... some children are stripping their parents of their assets and throwing them out onto the streets in order to get what they think is "owed" to them... a price is now being paid for the past debt incurred; Paul or no Paul it will get worse.

I know more than one 40+ year old unemployed child with children living with/off of their parents... without lifting a finger to help them... perhaps even hastening their death to collect their "share" by their presence.

Paul promises you nothing...

//www.curezone.org/forums/fm.asp?i=1056788#i

Perhaps people have indeed over the last few generations, become more comfortable depending upon their retirement system (how many of these have gone poof?) and government than their own families for support. Well if that is what they want, then they cannot complain about government wanting to tighten the collars around their necks by stripping their freedoms.

The truth is, the inevitable is going to happen... if Paul, and others like him get into office and manage to make any headway at all, the war in the Mideast may come to an end, some troops may be removed from other foreign soils, some freedom robbing congressional acts may be repealed, and some federal fiscal responsibility may change for the better, but it will come at a steep price... most people are not willing to pay that price today or tomorrow; not when they can pass it on to their children and it becomes out of sight, out of mind. They will lose their country in the process.

After all, Americans will be expected to work and work hard to make the change, to produce and compete... this is a big shift from our current way of life.

Paul or no Paul, either way, we will most likely be stuck raising grandchildren with multiple, perhaps, poor paying jobs, in cramped multi-generational housing situations (I know of situations now where 4 generations, 14 people, with 5 jobs or more are living in 3 bedroom trailers and worse), and without their "entitlements" including medical coverage... the government is broke and tanking as we speak... Paul or no Paul it all seems inevitable.

The people who tend to be enthusiastic supporters for Paul are fully aware of the task in front of them and this country, are not afraid to get their hands dirty and work hard for what they believe in. Most of them are self reliant... homeschoolers are an example; people who have found the public education system sorely lacking. Kennedy stated, "Ask not what your country can do for you; ask what you can do for your country". Perhaps this was a bit of foreshadowing of what could have\should have been but wasn't?

I think that Ron Paul supporters are putting everything that they have, including time and money, into doing for their country... whether you believe it or not. They are not afraid to accept responsibility, in fact they are enthusiastically embracing it. They, for the most part, are fully aware that we are at a point in time where we owe much more debt for our own and past generational mistakes and over indulgences, than we may ever be capable of recovering from... but, they are willing to try and fight hard as a last ditch effort to recover and save what they feel was once a great country.

They are giving up savings and vacation time to trump for him as if he is a last hope. I would like to think there is hope, but I am a realist too...

Paul or no Paul, our country is in for some big changes... on one hand, we can stay the course and accept our current direction quit complaining and get on with it, on the other, there is a bit of hope for change... to get back even a bit of what we have lost in the last 10 to 15 years would be a bit of comfort.

Life was not easy before the introduction of entitlement programs. 3 or 4 generations of family living in a single home was not unheard of, or uncommon even 70 - 100 years ago. What was so wrong with that? There were no nursing homes, no child or adult day care centers, no Social Security, no Welfare, no food stamps... people worked hard, had little, most had gardens to help feed themselves, and they got along fine. Family took care of family, neighbors took care of neighbors, local people and businesses supported their fellow local business and neighbors, schools, etc. etc.

Gangs are not a recent phenomenon, gangs existed in cities and picked up protecting the hood where police could not in the 1880s' through the turn of the century. Sure there are problems that will and must be faced... so what, there always will be.

It is quite simply a priority shift that must be made... government entitlements brought with it a price tag... a price of seemingly insurmountable national debt, and definitively lost freedoms. If we choose to stay the course or become ever more dependent on government, expecting things like universal health care, it will bring with it, further costs of freedom loss, along with further reductions in standards of living for the majority.

If you are fortunate to be one of the elite super-rich, you may escape some pain, perhaps just see a reduction in your net worth... you may even be fortunate enough to buffer some of your lesser privileged family's pain if you so choose to "share" your blessings with them.

Know this... either way, we will one day have to compete with countries where workers are willing to work for 1/20th or less than what an American worker will work for... this should give you a hint of what is to come in a global economy, with or without Paul, with or without freedom... if we do not begin to pay our debt now, the price will become ever more bleak for future generations... our children and/or grandchildren. One can choose to buffer this some now or not, IF we are afforded a choice... is Paul a viable choice given the potential future? I think so.

He may be far from perfect, but he just may be what is needed now... win the nomination or not... win the election or not... if not for anything else but to buy a little time and air our governments dirty laundry to the sleeping masses.

I agree that it is very unrealistic to think that any one man elected will solve all our ills, just as it is unrealistic to believe that "science" will always bail us out with another miracle "cure" or agricultural wonder... it is also a crime to turn our backs on the inevitable and sweep our current problems under the rug, leaving them for a future administration and generation to deal with at an ever increasing cost, including our freedoms.


 

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