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Christianity Debate Forum [Archive]

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Challenge the message and not the messenger!
The first person to resort to name calling and personal attacks automatically loses the debate!
Personal attack is often the best indication that the writer knows his logic is flawed and therefore tries to deflect attention by attacking the opponent, instead of attacking the arguments of the opponent.
 
  • James the Just, brother of Jesus.   Wiz   10y
     
    This is really long, and I didn’t even get through it tonight myself, but I am posting it for reference. James, brother of Jesus, led the first Christians in Jerusalem. This is a scholarly historical piece, based on conventional historical findings, dated 1982. A lot has come to light recently from the Dead Sea Scrolls about James, and his relationship to Paul and to Peter. ... ... Quote: ... ”Robert Eisenman, one of the most eminent researchers of early Christianity working today, has produced an exhaustive study of the historical milieu at the time of Jesus and come to the conclusion that James ...   [retrieve this message]
    • It was long but very interesting. I would have my doubts ab...   lamikin   8y
       
      It was long but very interesting. I would have my doubts about Nag Hammadi since it is from the tradition of Egypt that Mary is associated with the Holy Spirit. ... ... You said: ... ... It is not unreasonable to suppose that some of these who identified Jesus as ”a prophet like Moses” began to think of James, his relative, as ”a priest like Aaron.” ... ... ... Since the Messiah is depicted in the Old Testament as a priest and king, it was very confusing for the Jews that there could be one person since the roles of priest and king had always been seperated except for Samuel.   [End]
  • A couple of new books I just got...   Wiz   10y
     
    The Dead Sea Scrolls and the First Christians: Essays and Translations ... by Robert Eisenman, ... ... Synopsis ... This work challenges the established interpretations of the Dead Sea Scrolls and the traditional views of the origins of Christianity. By the author of ”The Dead Sea Scrolls Uncovered”, this book goes back to Qumran on the Dead Sea for further exploration of Christianity’s formative years. Included in the book are new translations of the Qumran documents, that until now have only been available to scholars, that present a more accurate view of the times. A picture of a nationalistic, x ...   [retrieve this message]
  • How could the Father tell the world of love and tenderness?...   swing71   10y
     
    How could the Father tell the world of love and tenderness? ... He sent his Son, a newborn babe, with peace and holiness. ... ... How could the Father show the world the pathway we should go? ... He sent his Son to walk with men on earth that we may know. ... ... How could the Father tell the world of sacrifice, of death? ... He sent his Son to die for us and rise with living breath. ... ... What does the Father ask of us? ... What do the scriptures say? ... Have faith, have hope, live like his Son, ... Help others on their way. ... ... What does he ask? ... Live like his Son. ...   [End]
    • Re: How could the Father tell the world of love and tendern...   Grog   10y
       
      How could the Father tell the world of love and tenderness? ... He sent his Son, a newborn babe, with peace and holiness. ... ... How could the Father show the world the pathway we should go? ... He sent his Son to walk with men on earth that we may know. ... ... How could the Father tell the world of sacrifice, of death? ... He sent his Son to die for us and rise with living breath. ... ... What does the Father ask of us? ... What do the scriptures say? ... Have faith, have hope, live like his Son, ... Help others on their way. ... ... What does he ask? ... Live like his Son. ...   [End]
      • What a hoot!   Wiz   10y
         
        chuckle, chuckle ... ... It is a very nice sentiment, if you choose to see things that way. ... ... Although ”it’s not my cup of dish” -- (words actually uttered by Lawrence Welk when talking about jazz music) ... ... ;0) ... ... Wiz ... ... ...   [End]
        • Re: What Does He Ask   swing71   10y
           
          To understand the word in this post you would also need to understand Where you came from, Why you are here, and Where you are going after you die. You would have to understand Our Heavenly Fathers Plan of Salvation.   [End]
  • The Bible is an Extraordinary Book   Blue Stone   10y
     
    Excerpt taken from Laura Knight-Jadczyk’s article: ... Part I: The Ark of the Covenant and the Temple of Solomon ... ... ... ... The Bible is an Extraordinary Book: A book which claims infallibility; which aspires to absolute authority over mind and body; which demands unconditional surrender to all its pretensions upon penalty of eternal damnation, is an extraordinary book and should, therefore, be subjected to extraordinary tests. ... ... But it isn’t. ... ... Neither Christian priests nor Jewish rabbis approve of applying to the bible the same tests by which other books are tried. ... ... Why? ... ... Because it ...   [retrieve this message]
  • Where do we non-bible believers get our 'stuff' from?   Wiz   10y
     
    (I moved this from a post below) ... ... PS Oh - I forgot tho - you ppl don’t go by the bible, you just make it up as you go along with whatever you think fits ... ... Good point. Incorrect, though. ... ... I for one, don’t actually make it up as I go along with whatever I think fits... ... ... I have ’come to believe’ in a expansive all encompassing view of spiritual growth that takes into consideration all positive and uplifting religious views and spiritual practices, from wherever they originated, and all teachings that promote LOVE, compassion and tolerance. I discount all restrictive, dogmatic, and neg ...   [retrieve this message]
  • Former Minister Adresses Trinity and Light   Blue Stone   10y
     
    Former Minister Paul Von Ward came out of the mainstream christianity box and in doing so has taken the expanded view of God. This kind of awareness comes about when one opens one’s mind as opposed to getting stuck in the conditioned story (someone else’s) (trap). ... ... Remain open and remain expansive and truth can be revealed. ... Stay closed and contracted and stagnate. ... ... Excerpt from article: ... ... What philosopher Gregory Bateson might have labeled ”substance” (phenomena), ”energy” (energeia), and ”no thing” (noumena), scientist Michael Talbot (see his book The Holographic Universe) wou ...   [retrieve this message]
  • Lucifer: A Self-sacrificing Archangel??   daizy4   10y
     
    Lucifer: A Self-Sacrificing Archangel? ... ... ... From: http://jump.to/gibbon ... ... When you read channeled messages, you can’t help but notice that most of the time they are filled with loving and stimulating messages stemming from angels and other-dimensional beings. You often hear that if you stick to emotions like hate and fear for long they can be quite limiting to your personal development. ... ... When I read a book by Gregg Braden (Walking Between the Worlds, 1997) I was grasped by the idea that the other-dimensional being called Lucifer, or ’the devil’ creates fear in many people, for a reaso ...   [retrieve this message]
    • Hi luap, ... ... Please read this info from the askmoreles...   pada   8y
       
      Everyone plays a part else there would be no reason to keep coming back ... ”You keep coming back, y’hear” ... ... Gregg’s got another book coming out that can be prereserved..looks good1   [End]
    • Amongst the flora and fauna creation has given Rennes les B...   #133722   4y
       
      Amongst the flora and fauna creation has given Rennes les Bains six hot and three cold natural water sources. ... Discover them. ... ... Rennes les Bains in 1873, the hot waters became a mystery still to be unraveled. 666 or its symbol is said to be the key. ... ... 6km to the highest regional peak gives a 360° panoramic view over the Aude valley. ... At the Large Lake start near the BBQ facilities. ...   [End]
  • beautiful channeled book with Jesus' words.....   daizy4   10y
     
    ... I am presently reading, for the second time, an absolutely beautiful book titled ”Love without End...Jesus Speaks”. It was channeled to an artist by the name of Glenda Greene. Jesus appeared to her for several months while having his portrait painted by her. She recorded their discourses....philosophy, quantum physics, and foremost Love..... ... ... The painting makes its rounds throughout the country to various churches, where people report profound peace in its presense. The link below has some sample pages from the book, as well as the portrait. ... ... I highly recommend the book....I cannot s ...   [retrieve this message]
  • Further proof that   #30230   10y
     
    apostacy is the majority. Sad -- but oh so true.   [End]
    • Perhaps...   blueskyy   10y
       
      Your idea of apostasy is another’s experience of spiritual growth? ... ... What are your thoughts on expansion versus contraction? ... ©†ƒ……•™¼‡_Original_Message_¾€š½ž¢«»¬ï°© ... ... Your idea of apostasy is anothers experience of spiritual growth? ... ... What are your thoughts on expansion versus contraction?   [End]
      • Believers are to grow in grace, walk in the steps to which ...   PBC   10y
         
        Believers are to grow in grace, walk in the steps to which one was called by God from before the foundation of the world, and stand fast in the faith of father Abraham. No expansion necessary when humility opens eyes.   [End]
        • pbc,   #30230   10y
           
          It’s always a wonderful experience to come in contact w/ a fellow believer. The soveriegnty of God is so reassurring and peace giving to the believer.   [End]
          • That is a bone of contention, isn’t it? I can’t imagine wh...   PBC   10y
             
            I, likewise, find it to be quite a blessing! :-) :-) :-)   [End]
            • It’s definitely not my show - I obey Gods Word because that...   Grog   10y
               
              It’s definitely not my show - I obey Gods Word because thats what he gave us. I love the Word of God but I know I fall short of His glory. All I can do is what is instructed and give it the best I can. Either we serve God or we serve self. Jesus told us to be His follower we must crucify the deeds of the flesh, take up our cross and die daily. I know I can do no good left to myself, the only good that comes from me is Christ resurrecting in me, only He can do what is good in the eyes of the Lord.   [End]
    • You forgot...   Wiz   10y
       
      ... the burning in hell part... ... ... ;0) ... ... Wiz   [End]
      • That is a bone of contention, isn’t it? I can’t imagine wh...   PBC   10y
         
        That is a bone of contention, isn’t it? I can’t imagine why it gets more attention than being eternally(rather than just on earth) separated from love found only in God. Think the desire to be one with Him will burn eternally?   [End]
        • ...actually, I could care less   Wiz   10y
           
          ... how others judge of my spiritual path, however I thought it odd that the term ’apostasy’ (spelled correctly here) should be seemingly pointed at the Esoteric Christian forum... ... ... ”An abandonment of what one has voluntarily professed; a total desertion of departure from one’s faith, principles, or party; esp., the renunciation of a religious faith” ... ... Many here have outgrown traditional Christianity, not renounced Christian ideals. We choose not to stay in spiritual grade school our whole lives, but to graduate on to a deeper understanding. ... ... The point of my reply was ... is the next ...   [retrieve this message]
          • ”Many here have outgrown traditional Christianity, not reno...   blueskyy   10y
             
            ”Many here have outgrown traditional Christianity, not renounced Christian ideals. We choose not to stay in spiritual grade school our whole lives, but to graduate on to a deeper understanding.” ... ... Yes Wiz, that was my point exactly. One of the many benefits of this spiritual expansion is the lack of concern for those that may not understand our chosen path. There is a comfortable sense of peace and knowingness as you see them and their behavior contradicting their ”professed” faith. As if ”God” could be so easily deceived. ...   [End]
            • In reality   #30230   10y
               
              it is only - ... ”Let us make us a name” - again and again. ... ... I know God is in control, I understand His soveriegnty, everyone is right where they belong, saying and thinking as He so wills. ... ... No contradictions here.   [End]
              • it is only - ... ”Let us make us a name” - again and again...   Wiz   10y
                 
                ... ... it is only - ... ”Let us make us a name” - again and again. ... ... Please explain. ... ... ...and what is the deal with apostasy ... ... ... ;0) ... ... Wiz   [End]
                • It is an observation   #30230   10y
                   
                  In reading thru the posts here, it is my understanding that what you folks seem to put alot of confidence in is ”feelings” and other reading materials. ... ... As for the ”let us make us a name” this is biblical.   [End]
                  • Sparks of God   Wiz   10y
                     
                    The Divine speaks through our feeling centers. Through our hearts, not our minds. The intellect (and the personality) is byproduct of physicality, a device designed to deal with the illusion of physical reality. ... ... We sometimes get trapped by the cleverness of our minds and what it constructs for us to believe. However the mind was built to interface in the plane of separation. That is where we are right now. Behind the veil. Cast into physical bodies, forgetting where our real home in Spirit is between lives, so that we can journey in the earth plane each time we are born with fresh eyes ...   [retrieve this message]
                    • Nice (nt)   Blue Stone   10y
                    • Re: Sparks of God   PBC   10y
                       
                      Just one question...if you pattern your life after Jesus, how do you act on holiness if you don’t have it? I’m being serious and not baiting. He is holy and I just don’t know how someone can act perfect unless embracing His way to God(meaning He has to be received as the person’s perfection and God’s propitiation).   [End]
                      • Re: Sparks of God part2   Wiz   10y
                         
                        How and why? ... ... I have come to believe that the version of ’his way’ that you mention is a human construct. It was manufactured, not handed down from God. All religions are man-made approximations of what their founders believed was ’of the divine’ ... ... God doesn’t hand-out specific religious instructions anyway. God is far, far beyond personification and human attributes. Spiritual principles and teachings come through ’tuned in’ souls, and through the ’realized master’(as Jesus was), however the moment that these great souls pass from the physical plane, their teachings become history -- p ...   [retrieve this message]
                        • Who says we don’t all have holiness within us? You must no...   PBC   10y
                           
                          Who says we don’t all have holiness within us? You must not have children??? Does any child come into this world and immediately improve upon holiness within? On the contrary, immediately self-perservation is evident and once mobility and other abilities develop, serious unrighteousness and pride issues unfold. They’ll continue to do so unless someone bends that child’s sinful will toward righteousness. Now don’t you believe that the Creator of man would provide a single way to fix the problem so we all wouldn’t pridefully construct our own remedy? He did. And man still constructs a ...   [retrieve this message]
                          • Perhaps YOU were born an unholy sinner...   Wiz   10y
                             
                            But I wasn’t born unholy. Neither was my child. (and neither were you or your children, my dear) ... ... BTW, I have adopted a mixed race little boy. He came into my life when he was 2 years old. He is 11 now. I guess I needed a kid, and he certainly needed a daddy, and apparently God was working in my life and in his. I am a bachelor, BTW, so it is somewhat unusual how this came about. But it did, and I am happy for it. God works in mysterious ways... *smile* ... ... He is a wonderful, clever loving little boy and says ’love you, daddy ’ all day long. (when he’s not sulking or acting rotten). He wa ...   [retrieve this message]
                            • Nope, sorry...don’t buy it. Have too much experience with ...   PBC   10y
                               
                              Nope, sorry...don’t buy it. Have too much experience with children and adults that still act like children drawing attention to themselves and wanting their own way rather than God’s. You see it in your own son...the ”wanting his own way” is the sin/flesh expression. God can ”restore” rather than ”awaken” what isn’t there. Granted folks can ”act” loving and kind when they learn that works to their advantage and best interest...but they can’t ”be” spiritual when God hasn’t ”moved back in”. Their spiritual aspect is ”dead” not ”asleep”. I know we disagree. I take God at His Word plus ...   [retrieve this message]
                              • So you raise little bible-bots...   Wiz   10y
                                 
                                Ooooo-kay... ;0) ... ... ... Listen, you believe you are born a sinner, (someone else on this forum said they were a filthy rag). Born in sin, and shame. The flesh is sinful/shameful/evil, you are lowly sinners.. yada yada yada ... ... I’m surprised you guys don’t still go around flagellating yourselves like they did in the middle ages. Or wearing hair shirts to prove your piety. ... ... Sorry, I am getting a bit snide here. ... ... I have always maintained anyone is free to believe what the wish, however that doesn’t mean I won’t take issue when my experience indicates the opposite.... ... ... YOU have to go out ...   [retrieve this message]
                                • Somewhere in all that we are almost on the same page Wiz! ...   krupaclassy   10y
                                   
                                  Somewhere in all that we are almost on the same page Wiz! It’s the part where you find God in all things around you. That’s something very special that not all persons can find easily. Me, I can feel God in all things. And If I can’t feel God’s presence, I’m not sure I want to be there. That’s something that some people find easy and other’s find difficult. Try to remeber that it isn’t necessarily easy. ... ... Those ancient histories are also more relevent than is often thought. Recall the quote saying that those who don’t learn from history are doomed to repeat it. So, in that aspect, ...   [retrieve this message]
                                  • That is perceptive...   Wiz   10y
                                     
                                    ... ;0) ... ... ... I find early Christianity a wonderful study and I have learned a great deal. However, as I have said, I don’t use the bible. There is a wealth of other material from non Orthodox sources that I find intriguing, as they it is so different than the traditional views. ... ... The Bible, is, of course, still a valid study for some. The old testament is a wonderful history book but it is just too far out of date -- unless you believe in owning slaves, marrying your dead brothers wife, stoning witches and committing genocide on a massive scale like Joshua and many others engaged in. Many ...   [retrieve this message]
                              • Re: Perhaps YOU were born an unholy sinner...   shalil   4y
                                 
                                Children act that way because it is what they believe is the best/Good way to act due to their limited knowledge. Their intentions are pure, even though their actions may not show it sometimes. That is our role as parents to teach children to act the Good way. It is a failure on the parents fault if a child grows to be an adult still making the same childish mistakes. ... ... You choose Good or Evil via your personal knowledge and then act upon your knowledge. Some Men(man&woman) act the same way, but Evil is a choice. We all have Free Will and according to the Bible we all posses the kno ...   [retrieve this message]
                    • yes nicely said n/m   Dreamz   10y
              • I don't understand?   blueskyy   10y
                 
                That is a beautiful sentiment but I don’t understand. In your initial post you said it ”was sad”? ... ...   [End]
                • It is sad to me   #30230   10y
                   
                  I am only human, I know God has a perfect plan, I know He will loose none that are His, but I can’t help the sadness it makes me ”feel” -- If up to me I would ”save” everyone, and have everyone come to the knowledge of truth - but my ways are not His ways. He is perfect, and so His plan is perfect too, this is where the comfort and rest come in. ...   [End]
                  • I am only human, I know God has a perfect plan, I know He w...   blueskyy   10y
                     
                    If you want to help people come to the knowledge of truth as you say, what do you think the best way to do that is? ... ... By being judgemental or living by example? ... ... What would Jesus do?   [End]
                    • How?   #30230   10y
                       
                      ... How am I being judgemental? ... ... I do not try to change or add anything to Gods Word, as instructed. We are told to judge a righteous judgement anyway. As far as doing what Jesus would do, I go by His Word. ... ... When He comes back, as it states in the book of Revelation, His eyes will be a flame of fire and He’s on a war horse. I believe that’s because He is angry. ... ... Scripture tells us in the end the truth will be turned into fables, ppl will only want to hear what makes them feel good, smooth and enticing words are favored over truth.   [End]
                      • We do not believe what you believe and there is little...   Wiz   10y
                         
                        ...(or in my case, no chance ) that we ever will. Those of us who seek God beyond the traditional doctrine have gone far, far past accepting a literal interpretation of the bible and a dogma designed by early church fathers, (as we feel that it has little to do with the actual teachings of Jesus) ... ... At least this is true for me. I can really only speak for myself. ... ... Therefore your terms God’s word or HIS plan for us are meaningless to me. They are based on a premise I don’t accept. ... ... I won’t argue with you though. If your beliefs work for you, fine. I truly hope your beliefs will serve y ...   [retrieve this message]
                        • yes   blueskyy   10y
                           
                          You can speak for me anytime Wiz. You summed it up perfectly. ... ...   [End]
                        • Beyond The Dogma Trap   Blue Stone   10y
                           
                          It is true of me too. Beyond the biblical dogma (or any other) is a place beyond fear and anger. A serenity and level of understanding that is available to anyone who is brave enough to venture out of the self limiting traps that branch out of our ego. Once the lock comes off, the hunger for growth continues as one’s awareness spirals and expands. The only requirement is to nurture the openess and guard against turning the spiral back into a closed circle (loop). Souls on their path of growth get various ”lessons” (experiences to make distinctions from) at each level and thus identify ...   [retrieve this message]
                          • I don’t find fear and anger in Bible truth. I have love, j...   PBC   10y
                             
                            I don’t find fear and anger in Bible truth. I have love, joy, peace, grace, mercy, freedom, etc. I think the problem is that folks equate ”system” with the body of Christ(Church). Negatives are only evident when the organism acts like a human organization with accountability to men first and foremost while Jesus is rarely considered. That is nothing more than horizontal religion of man searching for God which enslaves rather than a vertical relationship of God reaching man which frees.   [End]
                            • put to the sword...   Wiz   10y
                               
                              ”I have love, joy, peace, grace, mercy, freedom, etc.” ... ... That’s great but it sure doesn’t play out against the God of the bible... ... ... The God of the bible is a spiteful, jealous, vengeful God who encourages smiting, hacking and hewing, rending his enemies limb from limb. The Israelites massacred whole towns, whole cities, whole nations at his direction... (and they are still at it) ... ... It’s no wonder the so-called Christians in the White House are so bloody genocidal... ... ... ;0) ... ... Wiz   [End]
                              • The God of the Bible has a way of peace that people don’t l...   PBC   10y
                                 
                                The God of the Bible has a way of peace that people don’t like because it involves humility versus pride. Until that is embraced, He sure has permissive will and governmental control of evil thru military provision. I can’t imagine how you don’t understand how humbling it is for a Christian who knows God’s value of life to even pursue military action or embrace the death penalty as a deterrent to evil. It isn’t something taken lightly or viewed gleefully. Do you understand that a Christian God has involved in making such decisions knows that seeking God’s will in those 2 instances means ...   [retrieve this message]
                      • Re: How?   blueskyy   10y
                         
                        Your original post in this thread seems quite judgemental, wouldn’t you say?   [End]
                      • More spiritual grade school thinking...   chinook   10y
                         
                        ... come on.....do you really BELIEVE that God is going to come again on a ”war horse...with flaming eyes...because he’s angry”. These are words and images meant to scare the masses into living in fear of judgement. I don’t mean to sound patronizing, but we must look at the bible with open eyes....not blindly believing that it is literal truth. ... ... My question has always been, why is it so difficult to believe that there are and have been many many enlightened people in the world? and that Jesus was one of them? Buddha another? and all of the Dali Lhamas yet others? Yet those who ...   [retrieve this message]
                  • Please don't feel sad for us...   Wiz   10y
                     
                    Whatever YOU might believe, there are no lost sheep over here... ... ... ;0) ... ... Wiz   [End]
                    • The whole point of these forums were to believe outside sta...   #68716   10y
                       
                      The whole point of these forums were to believe outside standard orthodox teachings of men. And to seek the truth beyond the myths. Thus, arguing for the sake of arguing is fruitless. ... ... ... Its time to break fast! ... ... ... ... peace- ... ... ... We break it first with dates- then pray the sunset prayer. Then we actually sit down and eat a light meal. ... Thank God for water.   [End]
                      • Well, there may be many ways to understand humans but with ...   PBC   10y
                         
                        Some people aren’t engaged in an argument. ... ... May I ask the purpose of the fast ritual in your faith?   [End]
                        • Thats good, I like to think we can be kind to eachother! ( ...   #68716   10y
                           
                          Thats good, I like to think we can be kind to eachother! ( smile ) ... ... We fast for the same reason all pple have fasted since the beginning of time. For ( even if you don’t beleive me ) our God is the God of the Old Testament and New. Jesus commanded his ppl to fast and to pray and to give charity in the Sermon of the Mount. ... We have specific Holidays, we have Two. In Arabic they are called Eid. ... We have the Eid Holiday after fasting the entire 9th month of the islamic calendar, that is the month of Ramadhan. This month was the month the first revelation was revealed to the Last Prophet M’h ...   [retrieve this message]
                          • Sorry for the delay in returning/replying. Life! :-) ... ...   PBC   10y
                             
                            Sorry for the delay in returning/replying. Life! :-) ... ... Thanks for explaining...now I understand fasting in your faith a little better. I, however, don’t agree that it could be the same God only partly because of what you shared. You see, in my faith and thru the words of God in the Bible, fasting isn’t a means to attain the reward of everlasting life in Paradise and the wiping clean of sins completely. Fasting is simply a way for an individual to cleanse the body in varying degrees(beyond 40 days would have the body itself begin to be consumed) so the focus on yielding to the mind of ...   [retrieve this message]
                            • Re: thanks for the reply   #68716   10y
                               
                              I thank God everyday that I found Islam. Every waking hour. ... I have the truth for me, but if you and others insist it can’t be the same God, then I wont argue with you. ... One has to realize though, this relgion did not happen from some strange land, but the land Abraham had travelled to and built the House of Worship with his first born son Ismael. This is the Kaaba, the first house of worship ignored by Christians and Jews, partly because they dont know about it. This is not a passing religion or just a cult, but the same message God has given since He created Adam. I have found all the a ...   [retrieve this message]
                    • Re: Please don't feel sad for us...   daizy4   10y
                       
                      Lucifer: A Self-Sacrificing Archangel? ... ... ... From: http://jump.to/gibbon ... ... When you read channeled messages, you can’t help but notice that most of the time they are filled with loving and stimulating messages stemming from angels and other-dimensional beings. You often hear that if you stick to emotions like hate and fear for long they can be quite limiting to your personal development. ... ... When I read a book by Gregg Braden (Walking Between the Worlds, 1997) I was grasped by the idea that the other-dimensional being called Lucifer, or ’the devil’ creates fear in many people, for a reaso ...   [retrieve this message]
                      • Bad choice of words   #30230   10y
                         
                        In reality reading the posts here made me sad, not sad for you personally, you are right where your suppose to be, believing all the things your ordained to believe. I believe God & thats what sets ppl apart, I thank Him that I believe what I believe. It’s very comforting knowing I serve a God that will loose none that are His. Jesus came only for the lost sheep of the house of Israel, not the entire world. ... ... Oh - I forgot tho - you ppl don’t go by the bible, you just make it up as you go along with whatever you think fits   [End]
                        • thats so special and so bigoted! yous ppl is that in da bib...   Grog   10y
                           
                          thats so special and so bigoted! yous ppl is that in da bible? ... Or is yous pple what you are bfore you become yous sheepple! Follow the herd keep your nose in the grass and ask no questions! But just remember if you ever come out of that comma and look up all you will see is the rear end of your fellow sheeple! Baaaa! !   [End]
                          • Oh so typical   #30230   10y
                             
                            a mistake in typing is what you jump on, lol, ... God never ceases to amaze me w/ His creations. What a sense of humor!!! ... Name calling too, my my, at least my children have been taught better than that.   [End]
                            • Re: Oh soooooo typical   Grog   10y
                               
                              Don’t like it when someone calls you on your condescending attitude so you just keep pushin it, as if someone has just pushed your buttons! lol ! Don’t play the innocent, thats even more patronizing! And if you like to call names prepare to hear some! ... I believe everytime you enter a string with a condescendng, better then thou attitude someone will call you on it! And making fun of the spelling was a small part of my reply , what I really was refering to was your bigoted devisive name calling with the term ”you people” as if any one other then people who think like you are beneath you! ...   [retrieve this message]
                              • Nope - you got it wrong   #30230   10y
                                 
                                I honestly care not what you say or think, Gods Word is what I base my beliefs on. Being told numerous times that ”I do not believe the bible” is what I was referring to. You can say what you will, it’s been said before, it will be said many times more I feel sure. It’s not more than I deserve. Since I actually study scripture, I understand what Gods Word means and it brings great comfort to me. Even in all your obvious hatred, I can rest in the Word.   [End]
                                • Funny you dont seem to show you contentment or comfort in t...   Grog   10y
                                   
                                  Funny you dont seem to show you contentment or comfort in the WERD ! Its to bad you can’t learn to express that! Its not like your not accommodated here with the many religious forums here ... you have decided to post here, where your dogmatism is so out of place and seems so immature and childish! Perhaps Curezone can put up a Sunday school forum for those who just don’t get it! ... ©†ƒ……•™¼‡_Original_Message_¾€š½ž¢«»¬ï°© ... ... Funny you dont seem to show you contentment or comfort in the WERD ! Its to bad you can’t learn to express that! Its not like your not accommidated here with the many re ...   [retrieve this message]
                                  • WOW - you jumped into a conversation that didn’t include yo...   #30230   10y
                                     
                                    WOW - you jumped into a conversation that didn’t include you in the 1st place & want to call names, judge, and basically slander. You would be easy to pick out of a crowd w/ all the bitterness and contempt you have for ppl that love God and apply His Word in their life. ... ... I’ve noticed your angry posts several times in the Christianity forum but I will not post here anymore as I am tired of dealing with such rude behavior.   [End]
                                    • the pot calling the kettle black ! Your insistence on your ...   Grog   10y
                                       
                                      the pot calling the kettle black ! Your insistence on your credibility is a sign of your insecurity Im suprised your so called faith doesnt allow you to go beyond that!   [End]
                                      • Children...   Wiz   10y
                                         
                                        ...stop fighting. ... ... This is called the Enlightened Chistianity forum , not the Animosity forum. ... ... Let’s all act enlightened... ... ... ;0) ... ... Daddy Wiz ...   [End]
                                        • Gee Wiz! lol! Sorry I couldnt help myself I was trying to s...   Grog   10y
                                           
                                          Gee Wiz! lol! Sorry I couldnt help myself I was trying to support Miss Daizy and her right to post what she believes! The almighty numberd one has seen fit to tag the charming and benevolent Ms Daizy, not a nice way to treat a lady! I will try not to be such a reactionary brute, but its not an easy task with the permanant ongoing fundy attacks!   [End]
                                          • Re: Children x 2 ...   Wiz   10y
                                             
                                            I don’t want to see this devolve (good word, huh... yuk, yuk) into flaming. ... ... I just posted up top: ... ... ”The issue with the debates here recently seems to be between those who shed what we perceive as the limitations of traditional Christianity and those who consider those ’limitations’ are their core beliefs.” ... ... With that in mind, Traditionalists are taught believe we are completely and utterly wrong and they are completely and utterly right. No question. Over and out. In many cases, it is blasphemous to question their faith. They can’t help it, most have been indoctrinated from birth w ...   [retrieve this message]
                                            • Well come on Wizman , you just said there is no sense in an...   Grog   10y
                                               
                                              Well come on Wizman , you just said there is no sense in an open dialogue with them and if you’ve notice I dont even try to! They come on like they are the Word and all knowing and they admit they dont have a clue about what we are talking about so how can you include me as one of the childish ones ! Although I have no problem with that referance but just trying to understand you, what do you really mean or are you just trying to mediate a un metiatable circumstance! lol! I would have liked to see the string that was started by Miss Daizt to have continued onto an educated dialogue but the ...   [retrieve this message]
                                              • Re: Children x infinity ...   Wiz   10y
                                                 
                                                These are just phrases I use when people are arguing... ... ... ”Children... play nice” or ’Children, don’t fight” It is a jab, but a silly one. ... ... Yes, I am trying to mediate. And, I know that some people have very restrictive views. However, why let it devolve into mudslinging? Be bigger than they are, if that is the case. ... ... I don’t have any problem with anything that the traditional folks say. It is what they believe. They really truly believe they are in the right, and many are actually very sincere in those archaic beliefs (it amazes me, but what the heck... to each his own). ... ... Remembe ...   [retrieve this message]
                                              • You assume too much   #30230   10y
                                                 
                                                Grog, ... I know nothing of myself first and foremost all I do know is what scripture says and this is what I base my beliefs on. ... ... I am NOT a man - I am young female, you accuse me of what you are guilty of. You may rescue all you like but maybe it is you that should gather the facts before jumping to conclusions.   [End]
                                                • Well excuse me for thinking your anonymous number was male!...   Grog   10y
                                                   
                                                  Well excuse me for thinking your anonymous number was male! Perhaps it was the derogatory remarks that made it seem so machismo! If you have an enlightening message I would love to hear it, but a lot of us thought maybe to find some relief from th heavy hand nature of dogmatism that bombards those with a different point of view ! Quite ludicrous since a lot people come to these forums just for the purpose of finding new and interesting perspectives on life and everytime we try we run into the same confrontational dogmatist ! Over and over and over! Telling us we can’t and then calling us ...   [retrieve this message]
                                                  • Grog, ... Not to worry I won’t post here anymore, if you ar...   #30230   10y
                                                     
                                                    Grog, ... Not to worry I won’t post here anymore, if you are representative of the ”enlightened” I want no part of it. I only used biblical terms in trying to show what I meant. I did not personally attack you. You on the other hand showed your true colors in calling names and just being downright rude & aggressively mean spirited in general to me and all that firmly believe in the bible. ... ©†ƒ……•™¼‡_Original_Message_¾€š½ž¢«»¬ï°© ... ... Grog, ... Not to worry I won’t post here anymore, if you are reprentative of the ”enlightened” I want no part of it. I only used biblical terms in trying to show wha ...   [retrieve this message]
                                            • Re: Children x 2 ...   daizy4   10y
                                               
                                              Wiz, ... ... Just an FYI....I am not a ”damsel in distress”....actually I have been too busy to check in. (thank you Grog for your loyalty among like-minded people) ... ... I too have high hopes for this forum, and observe what appears to be a setback as part of the evolutionary process. chaos...evolution....chaos.....evolution, etc. ... ... And yes, the Support forum is the ”refuge”, but I question if on this debate forum, name calling needs to happen. Such as ”apostate” or ”lost soul”. I suppose so, but it’s not the enlightened, stimulating debate that I envisioned for this forum. And I ...   [retrieve this message]
                                              • language of the bible...   Wiz   10y
                                                 
                                                Daizy, ... ... When you are thoroughly steeped in the dogmatic language of traditional Christianity, there are no ’enlightened/esoteric/ progressive’ styled words or concepts in that dictionary. ... ... Their language and terms come from the bible and church doctrine, a doctrine that defines precisely what they can and cannot believe and it has a whole array of negative verbal terms and ideas against the non-believers, the heretics and such. (gee, that’s us!) ... ... Some people are caught up in this system and that is all they know. (repeat this sentence twice) ... ... Ms #30230 actually feels bad for us th ...   [retrieve this message]
                                                • Your 2 cents..   Blue Stone   10y
                                                   
                                                  ...is worth a ton in gold. ... ... I understand how people further on the path of awareness (more distinctions made)can get dismayed at times in the way that watching a fly bat against a window over and over again in an attempt to free themself gets a bit irritating. You want to go over and help the fly move over a foot and find the open doorway. ... ... But the truth is we all benefit from each other’s presence in the grand energy dance. ... ... Whether it be learning compassion or patience or...   [End]
                                                • so true.....   daizy4   10y
                                                   
                                                  ... and more and more opportunities to let go of the ego, as our love, understanding and *patience* grows..... ... ... thanks for your 2 cents Wiz..... ... ©†ƒ……•™¼‡_Original_Message_¾€š½ž¢«»¬ï°© ... ... ... ... and more and more opportunities to let go of the ego, as our love, understanding and *patience” grows..... ... ... thanks for your 2 cents, Wiz.....   [End]
                        • Servant?   Blue Stone   10y
                           
                          Would you say you are a servant? I always think of slavery when this concept arises. I am glad you enjoy your arrangment. My god was let out of ”my” constructed box a while back (how liberating) and when I let god out I noticed that it is not fear based, slavery based etc, but an expansive creative totality that includes everything. I personally think boxing things in can be useful for things like chocolate covered raisons but not for the creative, expansive unifying energy of total consciousness. ... ... For those running the attractor pattern of soul mining, all I can say is enjoy your sh ...   [retrieve this message]
                          • Yes   #30230   10y
                             
                            It’s definitely not my show - I obey Gods Word because thats what he gave us. I love the Word of God but I know I fall short of His glory. All I can do is what is instructed and give it the best I can. Either we serve God or we serve self. Jesus told us to be His follower we must crucify the deeds of the flesh, take up our cross and die daily. I know I can do no good left to myself, the only good that comes from me is Christ resurrecting in me, only He can do what is good in the eyes of the Lord.   [End]
                        • if we make you sad.....   daizy4   10y
                           
                          ... I invite you to go back to your own bible forum. We created this one as a refuge.....for intelligent debate....not condescending judgments and references to the ”lost sheep.” ... ... ... weez ppl are doin’ just fine!!   [End]
                          • It’s the Christinanity Debate forum and I will go back alth...   #30230   10y
                             
                            It’s the Christinanity Debate forum and I will go back altho I seem to see you guys over there quite a bit posting things that are nonchristian in nature. ... Maybe we all should take your advise.   [End]
                            • You are all making me sad...   Wiz   10y
                               
                              I had such high hopes for this forum... ... ... Daizy, isn’t the Enlightened Support forum the refuge? ... ... We should be able to debate here without animosity. If some people think their ship doesn’t stink, (er, I mean ship doesn’t sink.... well, you know what I mean) and that’s fine. But it shouldn’t be ’not stinking’ here. And that goes for all those posting here on both sides of the issue. ... ... Nobody needs to feel like they are being run off. OK? However those that drop the holier than thou attitude probably won’t get flamed. ... ... BTW, if someone wants to feel sadness or pity for lost sheep, tha ...   [retrieve this message]
    • sad.....   daizy4   10y
       
      ...that we have created a refuge here for enlightened souls and are still called apostates, on our own turf.....don’t get me wrong, I’m not offended....it’s just interesting... ... ©†ƒ……•™¼‡_Original_Message_¾€š½ž¢«»¬ï°© ... ... ... and sad that we have created a refuge here for enlightened souls and are still called apostates, on our own turf.....don’t get me wrong, I’m not offended....it’s just interesting...   [End]
      • so true...   chinook   10y
         
        YOu’re right, it is sad that we’re considered to have abandoned our faith. Truth be told, we’re expanding our faith not abandoning it !! It proves just how completely christianity has ”taken over” the world even though it makes up a fairly small part of the world’s religions.   [End]
  • Holy Mary mother of Jesus ( chapter Mary, Holy Quran )   #68716   10y
     
    Chapter - 19 ... ... MARYAM (MARY) ... ... BRIEF INTRODUCTION: ... ... The chapter was revealed at Mecca. There are six sections, ninety eight verses, seven hundred eighty words and three thousand seven hundred eighty letters in it. ... ... The chapter deals in detail with Hazrat Maryam the mother of Jesus christ, so it has been named Maryam. The chapter was revealed in Mecca before migration of muslims to Habsha, as when King Najashi of Habsha asked about prophet christ, then Hazrat Jafar recited the second section of this chapter. ... ... This chapter clearly describes the position of Jesus christ who was cre ...   [retrieve this message]
    • Good stuff...   Wiz   10y
       
      I read a bit, but I’ll have to take some time to digest it all... ... ... ;0) ... ... Wiz   [End]
      • Sorry that was the entire translation of the meanings of Ch...   #68716   10y
         
        Sorry that was the entire translation of the meanings of Chapter Maryam, it is kind of long. ... Just wanted to share the story of Jesus and his mother, who is considered by Muslims to be the most holy woman on earth ( in her time) and there are only three other women regarded as the same in their lifetime. So to this day and forever in islam- she is one of four most Holy women of all Gods created women. ... Note: of all the chapters of Quran, she is the only one that has a Chapter named after her. No other women have chapters named after them. Her lineage is well preserved as well. And therefo ...   [retrieve this message]
  • Bayside Prophecy Fulfilled:   #23578   10y
     
    Bayside prophecy fulfilled: ... ... Neo Nazis planned a coup d’état in Sweden... ... ... ”You do not understand, My children. Already Russia has plans to take over Sweden. I know this shocks you, My child, but it is the truth. Russia now plans to take over Sweden, and they are surveilling the place constantly. You will tell this to the world as an example, that if they could do that to Sweden, it can happen anywhere, My child. Yes, We tell you this because We have great hope that they will not be successful.” - Jesus, March 18, 1989 ... ... Nettavisen reported on October 25, 2004: ... ... Swedish neo Nazis p ...   [retrieve this message]
  • Mythras pagan cult the basis of western Christianity?   Wiz   10y
     
    Repost over here from Christianity forum (just in case) -- Wiz ... ... ... ... ... Western Christianity has MAJOR pagan overlays. The Mithras mystery cult is the basis for much of modern Christianity. As most of Jesus’ actual teaching were erased from, altered, or simply not included in the bible, we are left with a religion that reflects little of what Christ originally taught (and a lot of what Paul taught, and later what Constantine re-made by combining Christianity and Roman paganism to create a state religion...) ... ... An interesting bit I found on the web: ... ... ... ... ... Quote: ... ... There are some things ...   [retrieve this message]
    • Image Embedded Perhaps...   Blue Stone   10y
       
      ...we could see a Mithras statue enstated along side the cross in many Christian churches to commemorate the true origins of the fundamental Christian ideologies. ... ... ... Something like this? ... ...   [End]
    • Mithraic Practice and Christianity   Blue Stone   10y
       
      Mithraic Practice and Christianity Dr M D Magee ... ... The cave of the Tauroctony was the material world into which the soul had to descend to be purified before it could return to the solar realm of light and spirit. Initiates of the Mysteries of Mithras had to be ritually pure and were purified by baptism, as we are told by Tertullian, a third century Christian from North Africa, but they were obliged to undergo a series of eighty trials of increasing difficulty. The initiate, Dr O Seyffert, notes, had to remain unconquered—undaunted and unfazed by the tasks, which involved water, fire, hu ...   [retrieve this message]
      • Whoa... that's a lot of reading...   Wiz   10y
         
        I’m still pounding through the thenazerenway Essene (and other associated) websites. I’ll be busy for a while... ... ... We can discuss the Essenes next if you like, (but let’s pick sizable bits so it’s not overwheling) ... ... ;0) ... ... Wiz   [End]
    • Re: Mythras pagan cult the basis of western Christianity?   AvgJoe   10y
       
      An interesting rebuttal, to this claim, has been posted in the Christianity forum: ... ... http://curezone.com/forums/m.asp?f=290&i=8820   [End]
      • Interesting rebuttal...   Wiz   10y
         
        ”The earliest known examples of Mithras worship date back 4000 years to the Persian empires” ... ... Judaism absorbed aspects of Zoroastianism/Mithras, so the old testament writings do not predate the Mithras mysteries quite so easily. (Judaism actually took on many of the Zoroastrian/Mithras ideas during the Babylonian captivity) ... ... Nice try though. ... ... I will give you that there was the possibility of cross talk between ancient Judaism and Mithras and ’who influenced who’ will certainly always be up for debate. ... ... However, the fact remains that the Mithras pagan mystery cult mirrors (and cert ...   [retrieve this message]
        • ”The earliest known examples of Mithras worship date back 4...   AvgJoe   10y
           
          ”The earliest known examples of Mithras worship date back 4000 years to the Persian empires” ... ... ...so the old testament writings do not predate the Mithras mysteries quite so easily. ... ... It was stated in the rebuttal, ”the Old Testament was begun around 2000 B.C. and completed around 400 B.C.” That means that the Old Testament was begun around 4000 years ago, about the same time that the earliest known examples of Mithra worship was around. So, its possible that neither predates the other. ... ... And yes, I’m sure, ’who influenced who’ will certainly always be up for debate.   [End]
          • At least we know it couldn't go further back than 6000 year...   Wiz   10y
             
            or there would be nothing here but a gigantic, unasembled Leggo set... ... ... *grin* ... ... ;0) ... ... Wiz ... ©†ƒ……•™¼‡_Original_Message_¾€š½ž¢«»¬ï°© ... ... or there would be nothing here but a gigantic, unasembled Leggo set... ... ... *grin* ... ... ;0) ... ... Wiz   [End]
  • Wiz what do you think about this....   #68716   10y
     
    ... ... ... 82% of the words of Jesus are not his: ... ... ”The Five Gospels,” is a 550 page book containing translations of the Gospels of Matthew, Mark, Luke, and John. It was the result of a six year study by 24 Christian scholars from a number of Western universities. They decided to produce a translation of the Gospels which would be uncolored by the translator’s personal faith. It was decided that this translation was to give the reader an honest picture of what Jesus truly said. They scanned the text for the words of Jesus, and collect an index of over 1,500 such sayings. They then tested the ...   [retrieve this message]
    • The actual figure is about 90%   Wiz   10y
       
      ... from sources I have investigated, only some 10% is certain. However I think they are in the ballpark... ... ... This is another big reason that I discount the new testament except for it’s historical interest. The spirit of Jesus’ teachings were changed, his advanced spiritual lessons were edited out, and a whole plethora of pagan trappings and early orthodox church control devices were written in... and they put lots and lots of words that were never said in Jesus’ mouth... ... ... I have read most of the http://www.soulindia.com website. It is quite interesting. (uses a lot of the Edgar Cayce ...   [retrieve this message]
      • 100 percent of the words find their source in God. Those p...   PBC   10y
         
        100 percent of the words find their source in God. Those penning them in the original writings were simply channels of the Spirit moving thru them as channels. Consider the channels to be as musical instruments...the one person behind all the instruments is responsible for what is received by the ear yet each instrument is involved in the process so the experiences and characteristics of each also is plainly evident.   [End]
  • Isn't this interesting?   Wiz   10y
     
    Found on the SoulIndia site... ... ... ... ... LETTER TO TIBERIAS ... ... Few people are aware, that there is in existence today, in the Archives in Rome, a description of Christ. It is contained in a report written nearly two thousand years ago, by a Roman, Publius Lentulus, to his Emperor, Tiberias. It reads: ... ... ”There has appeared in Palestine a man who is still living and whose power is extraordinary. He has the title given him of Great Prophet, his disciples call him ’Son of God’. He raises the dead and heals all sorts of diseases.”He is a tall, well proportioned man, and there is an air of severi ...   [retrieve this message]
    • Who believes what we’ve heard and seen? ... Who would have ...   Eileen45   10y
       
      Who believes what we’ve heard and seen? ... Who would have thought GOD’s saving power would look like this? ... ... The servant grew up before God--a scrawny seedling, ... a scrubby plant in a parched field. ... There was nothing attractive about him, ... nothing to cause us to take a second look. ... ... He was looked down on and passed over, ... a man who suffered, who knew pain firsthand. ... One look at him and people turned away. ... We looked down on him, thought he was scum. ... ... But the fact is, it was our pains he carried-- ... our disfigurements, all the things wrong with us. ... We thought he brought it on himself, ... ...   [retrieve this message]
    • ... ... ... 82% of the words of Jesus are not his: ... ....   #68716   10y
       
      Just curious, what would be the colour of new wine? ... Would it be reddish... ... ... Very interesting description, and it sounds solid. Allahu alem- ... God knows best.   [End]
    • Some descriptions of Jesus as well...peace be upon him. htt...   #68716   10y
       
      Some descriptions of Jesus as well...peace be upon him. http://www.jesuswillreturn.com/s1_1b.html ...   [End]
  • Biblical References to Reincarnation   Blue Stone   10y
     
    Biblical References to Reincarnation ... ... ... The concept of reincarnation has been taught throughout the ages. The greatest philosophers of the Western world such as Socrates, Plato, Plotinus, Pythagoras, St. Augustine St. Clement, Origen and Jesus accepted and taught its understandings. ... ... ... -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- ... ... Many cultures base their beliefs upon the existence of the non-physical and its constant interaction with the physical. It is taught in and by Hinduism, Brahmanism, Vedic scriptures, Krishna, Jewish Qaballah, Buddhism, A ...   [retrieve this message]
    • Ressurection = reincarnation   Wiz   10y
       
      I have read that the original meaning of resurrection in Aramaic was re-incarnation. However, Saul/Paul, interpreted this teaching as bodily resurrection, (he had a thing for blood and suffering, and he was attracted to the pagan ’death cults’) ....so, ’bodily’ resurrection took the place of spiritual resurrection and the cycle of birth and death was replaced with a risen Christ, ... ... ... Jesus definitely taught reincarnation. He had traveled through India and Tibet during his lost years. He was known as Issa and later Yuz Asaf. There are also many who believe Jesus survived the crucifixion. ...   [retrieve this message]
      • The final journey of Jesus...   Wiz   10y
         
        A lot of people (including me, BTW) believe that Jesus survived the crucifixion and went on to minister to one of the lost tribes of Israel in Kashmir. ... ... There is a lot of historical evidence of this, however it is all in Persia, India, and Tibet. Any hint of this history has been suppressed, buried (or erased) in the west from almost the beginning of the Christian movement... ... ... I found an interesting take on this from India. (several other religions believe that Jesus did not die on the cross... and some have the documents to prove it) http://www.soulindia.com/Jesus/Journey_details/Jesu ...   [retrieve this message]
    • Re: Biblical References to Reincarnation   ulisi   10y
       
      Herod was obviously mistaken when he thought Jesus was John the Baptist. ... ... Jesus could not have been speaking of Elijah being ”here” literally as Elijah was translated into heaven without seeing death. And, Elijah came down from heaven personally with Moses to minister to Jesus in the garden just before the crucifixion. ... ... Since Elijah never died, he could not have been reincarnated as John the Baptist.   [End]
      • You were there?   Wiz   10y
         
        ...and saw that Elijah ’was translated into heaven without seeing death’ and that he ’came down from heaven personally with Moses to minister to Jesus in the garden just before the crucifixion’? ... ... ... or are you taking someone else’s word for it? ... ... I don’t mean to be flippant, however I respectfully submit that the bible has many mythical constructs that fill it’s pages. I suspect you will be able to quote chapter and verse to back up your assertion, however if it is fiction or allegory to begin with, turning fantasy into ’truth’ after the fact doesn’t mean it really happened... ... ... ;0) ...   [retrieve this message]
        • And were you there? Quite honestly, how do you know that t...   PBC   10y
           
          And were you there? Quite honestly, how do you know that the words you read by anyone aren’t reads with many mythical constructs that fill the pages? If those reads are fiction or allegory to begin with, turning fantasy into ’truth’ after the fact doesn’t mean what is said in in those are really true. With the Word of God inspired by God claiming to be Truth(and absolutely unchanging in that attribute) and given thru men He deemed righteous and preserved by God, then a person can certainly have the right track to wisdom found only in Him. One is only enlightened when coming face to face ...   [retrieve this message]
          • No, I wasn't there.   Wiz   10y
             
            However, I am not claiming I have found the ultimate truth based on a muddled, second, third and forth hand collection writings that have been rummaged through, cherry picked and slap-dashed back together. (now THERE is an analogy for you!) ... ... *grin* ... ... In fact I am not claiming I have found the ultimate truth at all. Only a wondrous personal truth that works in my life. ... ... You wrote: ... ”Quite honestly, how do you know that the words you read by anyone aren’t reads with many mythical constructs that fill the pages?” ... ... I don’t. ... ... Much we need to take on faith. And that is fine. However k ...   [retrieve this message]
        • Re: You were there?   ulisi   10y
           
          I understand your skepticism--been there. But...Too many things in the Bible have been proven in this century to be true that were once thought impossible such as... ... ... The ”experts” once said that there was never anyone named ... ”David” in that time slot. But when archaeologists excavated in that area--guess what?!! There was King David’s name. Hmmm! ... ... The ”experts” once claimed that there wasn’t enough gold in the whole world to have adorned Solomon’s temple as described in the Bible--Wrong! ... ... There are many, many such instances. If you are interested in searching for truth with me ...   [retrieve this message]
          • I appreciate your friendly offer...   Wiz   10y
             
            I like to think I gave an open mind and I will entertain any other points of view that have some basis for authenticity (either factual, historical, or spiritual) ...although... simply claiming your statements are the ’word of God’ because they are found somewhere in the bible is a poor substitute for the investigative process and for critical thought. ... ... Now I ask... Is your mind made up? Are you open to new ideas? ... ... ;0) ... ... Wiz ...   [End]
            • You’ve got me mixed up with someone else. I’ve not simply ...   ulisi   10y
               
              You’ve got me mixed up with someone else. I’ve not simply said that the Bible is the word of God although I have come to believe that. You will find that I am open-minded, like to study all religions, history and science. I’ve come to believe in the authenticity of the Bible through much investigative study. I studied ”both” sides, and continue to do so in case I have missed something. I welcome your objections or disagreements as an incentive to study different subjects more deeply. ... ... I don’t intend to try to ”convert” you, but to bring to your attention some facts that you may not ...   [retrieve this message]
              • Well then...   Wiz   10y
                 
                ...perhaps we can discover some spiritual principles together. I don’t like to use the term ’truth’, because although there is an underlying and ultimate spiritual truth, it has many faces that it wears for all the many different people, and it speaks in the language and with symbols that they can comprehend. ... ... We come to know the divine through our beliefs, and those beliefs we usually dress in the cloth of our own understanding.... and if the power of God does ’talk’ to us, it is through our hearts rather than our minds. The mind can play tricks on us... but the heart rarely does. ... ... T ...   [retrieve this message]
                • Dear Wiz, Your letter could just as well have been written...   ulisi   10y
                   
                  Dear Wiz, Your letter could just as well have been written by me--Ditto! Ditto! Ditto! ... ... I’m an unusual type of Christian as I have no prejudices (I think). And, guess what! I don’t think I’m better than ANYbody. I am kind of a thorn-in-the-side of fellow Christians, though, as I demand consistency of them and logical reason for their beliefs. And, I don’t mind pulling the rug out from under them if they take a ”holier-than-thou” atitude. ... ... What I would like to do is share some of the data that contributed to my reaching the conclusion that the Bible is reliable in its tenets. ...   [retrieve this message]
                  • Hi Ulisi, pleased to meet you...   Wiz   10y
                     
                    You sound open-minded, and that is great. ... ... I don’t see that anyone’s beliefs are better or worse than anyone elses if they serve the light, and if the live with love, tolerence and compassion for their fellow man. ... ... I have largely bypassed the bible. I have my reasons, and I don’t ’expect’ anyone else to see it through my eyes. I don’t project my beliefs, my point of view, or my spiritual ’Eureka’s’ on others. It is not THE truth, it is MY truth. (or my take on the truth) ... ... I allow others their own path and their truth, and I judge not. However, I don’t need to be preached to as a hea ...   [retrieve this message]
  • Paul   #68716   10y
     
    Hi, ... This is a link to a short article regarding Saul ( Paul ) ... ... Im not going to paste the entire article for the sake of those who do not wish to see it unless they choose to. ... ... Of course this article may have some mistakes, and I ask forgiveness if there are any. To God first and then to anyone who may read this. ... ... Its just that one person had mentioned Paul and how he never met Jesus, yet Jesus never told us about Paul, which is a major part of christianity. Its interesting why it does not talk about it. Yet the bible talks about other events happening.... ... ... I realize this is a touc ...   [retrieve this message]
    • Hi Mo4, ... From what I know about Paul (Saul in Hebrew), h...   beej   10y
       
      Hi Mo4, ... From what I know about Paul (Saul in Hebrew), he was born at Tarsus in Cilicia. ... He was of the tribe of Benjamin,the youngest son of Jacob. ... He was a Pharisee in faith. ... He studied law with Gamaliel at Jerusalem. ... ... Acts 22:3 I am verily a man which am a Jew born in Tarsus, a city in Cilicia, yet brought up in this city at the feet of Gamaliel and taught according to the perfect manner of the law of the fathers, and was zealous toward God, as ye all are this day. ... ... You can take the boy out of the country, but not the country out of the boy. ... ... Paul was a law keeper, and he loved ...   [retrieve this message]
      • Thanks. He was a lawyer? lol- ... Kidding aside, its just t...   #68716   10y
         
        Thanks. He was a lawyer? lol- ... Kidding aside, its just that I find it odd that he was a law keeper then told people that the law dos not matter. ... Regarding, food and drink. ( pork was not allowed for anyone ) ... Regarding the covenant of circumcision. ( which was not taken lightly as Abraham did this himself in old age ) ... Regarding the Sabbath, which was a great sin to disregard. ... ... And there is no talk from Jesus that this would happen. If God never changes- then this Law would not just change, maybe it would slightly, but Paul changed MAJOR parts of it. ... ... Another similarity with the Law o ...   [retrieve this message]
        • I think that the confusion about law is caused by grouping ...   beej   10y
           
          I think that the confusion about law is caused by grouping them in one pot. There are basically three types. ... ... 1, The Ceremonial law contained in ordinances. Eph. 2:15 ... It was written by Moses. 2Chr. 35:12 ... It was abolished by Christ. Eph 2:15 ... It involved things like sacrificing animals, passover and circumcision. ... It promoted feelings of guilt, remorse and pain. It dealt with sin. ... ... 2, Then you have miscellaneous laws from Moses. Things like don’t eat pork, animals that died of themselves (sick ones), strangled animals (road kill). Don’t marry your sibling. ... These laws promoted health. ...   [retrieve this message]
          • I think that the confusion about law is caused by grouping ...   #68716   10y
             
            1, The Ceremonial law contained in ordinances. Eph. 2:15 ...   [End]
            • Eph. 2:15,16 Having abolished in his flesh the enmity, even...   beej   10y
               
              Eph. 2:15,16 Having abolished in his flesh the enmity, even the law of comandments contained in ordinances; for to make in himself of twain one new man, so making peace; And that he might reconcile both unto God in one body by the cross, having slain the enmity thereby: ... ... ROMANS 2:25,26 For circumcision verily profiteth, if thou keep the law: but if thou be a breaker of the law, thy circumcision is made uncircumcision. Therefore if the uncircumcision keep the righteousness of the law, shall not his uncircumcision be counted for circumsicion? ... ... This is from the King James Version. ... Peac ...   [retrieve this message]
              • Hi, ... The first paragraph is not the words of Jesus, its ...   #68716   10y
                 
                Hi, ... The first paragraph is not the words of Jesus, its talking in the third person, therefore red flags go up- who is the author of this. ... The second paragraph makes no sense...(smile_ and who is the author if it? ... ... ... thanks   [End]
                • Both are from Paul. n/m :-)   beej   10y
                  • Re: Both are from Paul.   #68716   10y
                     
                    And NOT from Jesus, peace be upon him! ... Paul wasnt even a companion of Jesus and never knew Jesus....... hmmmm. ... thanks~ I am always learning something- ... :) ...   [End]
                • Re: Paul   beej   10y
                   
                  Colossians 2:9-12 New Intrnational Version ... For in Christ all the fullness of the Deity lives in bodily form, and you have been given fullness in Christ, who is the head over every power and authority. In him you were also circumcised, in putting off of the sinful nature, not with a circumcision done by the hands of men but with the circumcision done by Christ, having been buried with Him in baptism and raised with Him through your faith in the power of God, who raised Him from the dead.   [End]
                  • Again Jesus did not predict this, tell us about it, but som...   #68716   10y
                     
                    Again Jesus did not predict this, tell us about it, but someone after Jesus was gone added this to scripture.....Paul is the dominate Author of the Bible, not Jesus apparantly. ... Correct?   [End]
                    • Good call (nt)   Blue Stone   10y
                    • Re: Paul   beej   10y
                       
                      You are right, in a way. All of these texts are parts of letters that Paul sent to the churches that were planted among the Gentiles. ... He does say that Jesus spoke to though. ... He also met with the others who were with Jesus before the cross. ... ... Peace :-)   [End]
                      • Yes I heard Paul saying he saw Jesus in a vision. ... If Je...   #68716   10y
                         
                        Yes I heard Paul saying he saw Jesus in a vision. ... If Jesus came down to change the Law he said he came to fulfill not change, even one letter of it, not only Paul would see him but everyone, and he would make his new Laws clear for the masses to follow. ... Only a vision. Is that all.... ... This was not mentioned in the bible as well. ... ... God is not the author of confusion, but this is.   [End]
                        • The book of ”Acts of the Apostles” ,the fifth book of the N...   beej   10y
                           
                          The book of ”Acts of the Apostles” ,the fifth book of the New Testament, is supposably compiled by Luke. (One of 12) ... ... If you read Acts 9 it has alot to say about Paul. ... ... I’m getting the feeling that you don’t have a Bible. It’s not a sin to own a book that you don’t agree with. I have a few just for argument sake. ... ... Peace :-)   [End]
                          • Re: thanks the exchange...   #68716   10y
                             
                            ... Actually I had a Bible, but dont know what, where it is now, after we relocated. ... I read the Quran, but do read the scriptures sometimes, and we have stories in the Quran that detail Joseph, Moses, Jesus, and many other prophets lives. We also have the the same stories with more detail in the sayings of prophets Mhammed has recorded by divine guidance. You would be amazed at hearing them, absolutely mind opening. ... From Adam all the way to M’hammed. They confirm the Biblical accounts but put the prophets in a higher light, as we find in the bible accounts of Noah being drunk and naked for ...   [retrieve this message]
        • Notice what Jesus has to say about the sabbath.   PBC   10y
           
          When studying the Bible, it is very relative to understand the moral law versus ceremonial law and to whom each are directed/given along with when and their purpose. It’s also important to realize that what God doesn’t want, and what the Bible teaches(one can see this by not even reading what was said thru Paul) is that righteousness isn’t attained by human keeping of any Law of God(here is a difference between religion of working to be accepted and relationship thru finished work of Jesus and a person being counted as God’s workmanship that will have evidence of being conformed to the im ...   [retrieve this message]
          • Luke 6:5 And he said unto them, That the Son of man is Lord...   beej   10y
             
            Luke 6:5 And he said unto them, That the Son of man is Lord also of the sabbath. (The Lord’s day) ... ... Rev.1:10 I was in the Spirit on the Lord’s day, and heard behind me a great voice, as of a trumpet, ... ... Gen2:3 And God blessed the seventh day, and sanctified it:... ... ... This day was made holy before man sinned. ... Mark 2:27 And he said unto them, The sabbath was made for man,...   [End]
    • It's not touchy to me....   Wiz   10y
       
      Paul and his early followers were largely responsible for the first pagan add-ons to orthodox Christianity. The death and resurrection, virgin birth and so on. He took the movement outside of Israel to the Gentiles, and attached a lot of the Mithris mystery cult ideas onto the original Christian teachings. ... ... The Essene Christian movement (which was in opposition to Paul and his paganized hybrid) was led by James, brother of Jesus. James was stoned to death in Jerusalem and his followers were persecuted. Not long after, the Romans destroyed Jerusalem (in 70 AD ) and the original version o ...   [retrieve this message]
      • So about original sin, this was an add on also? ... I think...   #68716   10y
         
        So about original sin, this was an add on also? ... I think it was, In Islam Jesus, Peace be upon him, was not responsible for the sins of all of mankind. he was rather a saviour in the sense that at that time if anyone followed him, then they would be saved. Likewise are told we are responsible for our own actions as well. ... And I found this about it. ... Is Jesus responsible for our sins? ... Humans are born without (original sin of man) according to the Bible: ... ... (Deuteronomy 24:16): ”The father shall not be put to death for the children, neither shall the children be put to death for the father ...   [retrieve this message]
        • Original sin...   Wiz   10y
           
          Original sin is not part of the original teachings. (We are not born sinners as we incarnate again and again from lifetime to lifetime to work out our karma and grow spiritually) ... ... Original sin is a religious ’control’ device, as is the hierarchy of the early church -- that the word of God came first through the bishops and priests, who were God’s representatives, and then to be passed out to the laity as they saw fit. ... ... So, original sin, Jesus, the redeemer of sins, who died for our sins, and several other foundational beliefs of modern Christianity were add-ons. ... ... ;0) ... ... Wiz ... ... ...   [retrieve this message]
          • I believe the original sin is hunger...believing that there...   risingsun   10y
             
            I believe the original sin is hunger...believing that there is something that one needs outside of God...but it is a choice one makes...an agreement that one will hunger if they choose to enter into the material world... A newborn baby cries for what she does not know but dies if she does not find her mother’s breast... If the hunger is fed then whatever that hunger is will only be satisfied but for only a time... ... ... Jesus called himself Adam before him and accepted that original sin as his own(re-incarnation?) only he became an overcomer of the world... I would love to have witnessed the ...   [retrieve this message]
            • Christ consciousness...   Wiz   10y
               
              I don’t believe Jesus died on the cross, but lived to travel on to India and Kashmir... so as he didn’t ’survive the grave’ and ascend up to heaven as many Christians believe. ... ... There is gigantic difference in how I view the teachings of Jesus and how Orthodox Christianity does. Salvation through Christ is meaningless concept to me as is original sin, the virgin birth, Jesus as God or the son of God as a part of the Trinity etc. ... ... Jesus was a great spiritual teacher and the most evolved being incarnate up to that time. He took on the state of Christ consciousness in the last days of his ...   [retrieve this message]
              • Throwing away one dogma and putting on another may make sen...   risingsun   10y
                 
                Throwing away one dogma and putting on another may make sense to you but I believe that Jesus overcame the grave...a great story and the way I process the invisible God. ... ... Things we agree on: ... ... Jesus was a great spiritual teacher and the most evolved being incarnate up to that time. ... ... He took on the state of Christ consciousness in the last days of his ministry in Jerusalem. ... ... Christ consciousness is a perfected reflection of the divine incarnated into earthly terms, and Jesus Christ was an incarnation of that perfected Infinite Soul. ... ... I, like Edgar Cayce, like to think of Jesus a ...   [retrieve this message]
                • Dogma?   Wiz   10y
                   
                  I didn’t adopt another dogma. I follow no church doctrine. In fact I don’t even call myself a ’Christian’ per se, as there are numerous spiritual teachings that are valid, and I don’t limit myself to any single path. ... ... I have studied the actual history of Jesus available outside of the one manufactured by orthodox Christian churchmen over the centuries. It is far different than the accepted ’party line, and I find this expanded, enlightened take on Christianity very refreshing... more spiritually stimulating and much more to my way of thinking, feeling and doing... ... ... In fact, now that v ...   [retrieve this message]
              • Like in Song of Solomon   Dreamz   10y
                 
                IE: ... as Jesus referred to the Way thru him/ ... so also does Song of Solomon refer the shepherd girl.. ... to follow the footsteps of those who have gone before etc.. ... ... i wrote a song myself along time ago about this... ... where in the wording i used was.. ... ... and i will not a vagabond be, ... if you show me the path that you keep. ... ... Jesus himself referred to us as brothers and sisters ... as friends. ... ad being one with him/ sharing in him as joint heirs etc. ... all of these things refer to equality. ... ... if he is one with god and we are equal to jesus and parts of god also, ... then we are gods also. ... t ...   [retrieve this message]
                • IE: ... as Jesus referred to the Way thru him/ ... so also...   Blue Stone   10y
                   
                  IE: ... as Jesus referred to the Way thru him/ ... so also does Song of Solomon refer the shepherd girl.. ... to follow the footsteps of those who have gone before etc.. ... ... i wrote a song myself along time ago about this... ... where in the wording i used was.. ... ... and i will not a vagabond be, ... if you show me the path that you keep. ... ... Jesus himself referred to us as brothers and sisters ... as friends. ... ad being one with him/ sharing in him as joint heirs etc. ... all of these things refer to equality. ... ... if he is one with god and we are equal to jesus and parts of god also, ... then we are gods also. ... t ...   [retrieve this message]
        • Very interesting line of thought thanks n/m   Dreamz   10y
  • The Nature of Our Being (God's Game)   Blue Stone   10y
     
    THE NATURE OF OUR ’BEING’ Alex Paterson ... ... The US psychiatrist, Stanislav Grof, aptly describes ’reality’ as we perceive it as a ’game’, because in essence we and the whole Universe (and that includes all experiential realms, not just the physical universe) are nothing more than a figment of the Creative Principle’s imagination. 1 Even our very nature of being separate ’sparks of life’ with a ’separate’ consciousness and free will is in essence just a grand illusion, for in actual fact we are God and as such there is no real separation between us and God. ... ... Some will find this statemen ...   [retrieve this message]
  • Duality Principle   Blue Stone   10y  C
     
    The duality principle by Sabah E. Karam ... ... (excerpted from http://www.posttool.com/cisna/dual.html ... ... The preceding remarks imply that it is impossible to establish a unifying conceptual model from which we can view all the scientific disciplines. Some would argue that we have to seek convergence beyond the domain of science itself. The arguments against successfully producing a unified model are strong. My argument is that the Quranic verse 51:49 is a clear principle which can be applied to, not only, the scientific disciplines, but also, to the social and behavioral sciences. This p ...   [retrieve this message]
    • A First Look at Unity, Duality, and Complexity   Blue Stone   10y
       
      A First Look at Unity, Duality, and Complexity ... Daniel Casasanto ... ... Science, as we understand it in Western culture, arose during the Golden Age of Greece. Greek mystics in the sixth century B.C. did not distinguish science from philosophy and religion, but combined them in an endeavor to discover the ”essential nature” of things, which they called Physis. (Capra, 1975) Heraclitus of Ephesus proposes in Concerning Nature (ca. 500 B.C.) that all things are in a continual process of ”Becoming”; (Capra, 1975) He depicts a world composed of paired opposites (hot/cold, wet/dry, etc.) which st ...   [retrieve this message]
      • Light on/ light off/ yet light still exists in darkness   Dreamz   10y
         
        i love the visual in this post wherein it states turning out a flashlight does not mean that light no longer exists, just because you cannot see it.. ... ... just as absense of darkness when you turn it back on does not mean darkness no longer exists. ... ... when the sun shines on one part of the earth, the other part is in darkness ... yet both are in existence in same time ... ... very nice posts ... thank you ... ©†ƒ……•™¼‡_Original_Message_¾€š½ž¢«»¬ï°© ... ... i love the visual in this post wherein it states turning out a flashlight does not mean that light no longer exists, just because you cannot see it.. ... ... ju ...   [retrieve this message]
    • Pair of Opposites (Essenic Principle)   Blue Stone   10y
       
      The great Essene teachers that taught master Jesus explained duality as follows: ... ______________________________________________________________ ... ... ”Everything is dual; everything has poles; everything has its pair of opposites; like and unlike are the same; opposites are identical in nature, but different in degree; extremes meet; all truths are but half-truths; all paradoxes may be reconciled.” ... ... The Principle of Polarity embodies the truth that all manifested things have ”two sides”; ”two aspects”; ”two poles”; a ”pair of opposites,” with manifold degrees between the two extremes. The ...   [retrieve this message]
  • Who does God talk to???   Wiz   10y
     
    Several folks here claim that the God of the bible talks to them... (and has talked to Christians and pre-Christian Jews throughout the ages). ... ... In a way, yes, the power of God talks to us... through our higher selves, through our spirit guides and guardian angels, though our selfless acts for others, through the examples we set when we aid and assist in the spiritual growth of our fellow man. God speaks through love, compassion and tolerance. ... ... But is this talking God just the God the Bible, an exclusively Christian God? One that talks just to certain Christians now days who believe in ...   [retrieve this message]
    • A big turning point in my life was reading a book called Da...   beej   10y
       
      A big turning point in my life was reading a book called Daniel and the Revelation by Uriah Smith. It compares the book of Daniel to history and the symbols of Revelation become so much easier to understand. ... ... Read Rev 13, just a quick through, make a little note of the creatures of the 2nd verse. ... Now read Daniel 7. This was history foretold through vision. ...   [End]
    • A big turning point in my life was reading a book called Da...   beej   10y
       
      I feel that G.W.Bush is a threat to our religious liberty. ... I don’t think God speaks to him. I think Scull and Bones does.   [End]
    • Re: Who does God talk to???   #3922   10y
       
      If you haven’t heard from God yet, it is only because you are not listening. Pray and meditate on nothing... listen for love over the ringing in your ears and chatter of your mind...filter out the ego... if love comes shining through and speaks to you not from your own thoughts but God’s thoughts...be still...and listen...God is talking to you.   [End]
      • ...To be absent from the body, and to be present with the L...   beej   10y
         
        ...To be absent from the body, and to be present with the Lord...   [End]
      • Defining terms...   Wiz   10y
         
        ... We have a matter of semantics happening here I just realized. ... ... God works in my life all the time. And I suppose if I had a traditional religious upbringing, I might also say that I have a ’heard’ from, or ’talked to’ a Christian styled God. ... ... The Divine is a part of my live and I recognize it’s power, however it wears the cloak of no relgion and and is beyond any aspect of physicality although the physical world is contained inside God.... ... ... I guess it depends on how you define God. I don’t personify God. All communication to physical beings is filtered through the higher self which ...   [retrieve this message]
        • 7 planes of existence   Wiz   10y
           
          ... ... ... The 7 Planes of Existence ... (excerpt from The Journey of Your Soul) Michael Teachings ... ... BY SHEPHERD HOODWIN ... ... Just as there are seven colors in the rainbow and seven tones in a musical scale, each with a different vibratory rate, there are seven levels of being on the spectrum of creation. The slowest speed of vibration occurs on the physical plane; the highest, on the buddhaic plane. From the buddhaic plane, energy returns to its source, the Tao. ... ... Physical plane: The densest of the seven planes; where we presently reside. ... ... Astral plane: The second plane of creation. Its mediu ...   [retrieve this message]
    • Re: Who does God talk to???   Eileen45   10y
       
      For anyone that is interested in a lay person’s argument for the existence of the biblically defined Christian’s God - I recommend you read ”Mere Christianity” by CS Lewis.   [End]
  • peace to you out there   #68716   10y
     
    Whoever may be reading this, just wanted to say hello. ... If anyone ever wants to talk about Jesus, the similarities we share regarding him, or the similarities of his sermons and M’hammeds sermons it would be interesting. ... Ive learned a lot with talking to you all, and it has led me to read some of the sermons of Jesus, peace be upon him. I find they are exactly the same message as M’hammeds sermons. ( pray, fast, charity, how the poor were the main followers, how they were both set up against and hurt by their own ppl, etc ) ... If any feel offended let me know and forgive the post then and f ...   [retrieve this message]
    • I can’t speak for everyone here but I think your posts abou...   #3922   10y
       
      I can’t speak for everyone here but I think your posts about Jesus would be better suited if they were posted in the Esoteric/Progressive Christianity Support Forum. We could discuss the Jesus of the Koran and Jesus of Gnostic and Christian references and find comonalities. It seems an interesting topic to me. Blessings to you MO4 and I think you will find the new forum would welcome your input with open arms. ... ... ... ... ©†ƒ……•™¼‡_Original_Message_¾€š½ž¢«»¬ï°© ... ... I can’t speak for everyone here but I think your posts about Jesus would be better suited Esoteric/Progressive Christianity Suppo ...   [retrieve this message]
    • I for one welcome your ideas here...   Wiz   10y
       
      Besides the progressive aspects of Christianity, this forum is also designed to debate esoteric Christianity, which recognizes the underlying validity of all religions and spiritual practices as they relate to Christian thought, and even incorporates some of their ideas. ... ... If it makes some folks uncomfortable, good. Maybe they will re-examine and expand their beliefs and come to better understand the spirituality of others. ... ... If not, no harm done.... ... ... ;0) ... ... Wiz ... ©†ƒ……•™¼‡_Original_Message_¾€š½ž¢«»¬ï°© ... ... Besides the progressive aspects of Christianity, this forum is also designed to ...   [retrieve this message]
    • Offended Nah   Blue Stone   10y
       
      I feel that G.W.Bush is a threat to our religious liberty. ... I don’t think God speaks to him. I think Scull and Bones does.   [End]
    • Hello my neighbor. n/m   beej   10y
  • Calling Card   Blue Stone   10y
     
    I am having some cards printed up to hand out when dogmatic religious recruiters show up at my door. I will accept their pamphlets so long as they accept my card which will simply declare: ... ... I am God   [End]
    • wow !but I am God 2 !! roflamo ! 'splain that Ricky! n/m   Dreamz   10y
    • btw, you are such a card !! n/m   Dreamz   10y
    • Re: Calling Card   Wiz   10y
       
      I keep petitioning my local churches with that same thought, but darn it, they won’t send the proceeds of their collections plates. ... ... Of course, I am a poor excuse for a vengeful God, since I can’t really do any quality smiting to get my way ... not like I could in the old days... ... ... *sigh* ... ... ;0) ... ... Samael ... ... ... ... ... ©†ƒ……•™¼‡_Original_Message_¾€š½ž¢«»¬ï°© ... ... I keep petitioning my local churches with that same thought, but darn it, they won’t send the proceeds of their collections plates. ... ... Of course, I am a poor excuse for a vengeful God, since I can’t really do any quality smiting to ...   [retrieve this message]
    • It’s a deal; can we do this over the internet door, too??? ...   PBC   10y
       
      It’s a deal; can we do this over the internet door, too??? And please don’t complain because you made me(suppose you meant me?) an offer. :-) ... http://gty.org/bible_faqs/bible_faq.php?PHPSESSID=07ccf03d1b96b1411c86973eb23... ... http://biblebb.com/ ...   [End]
  • Forum name and description?   Wiz   10y
     
    Ok daizy, here goes... ... ... The name. Progressive Christianity or Esoteric Christianity? Or something else? How about the Christian Heretic’s forum? Our logo could be a burning pile of lumber with a stake in the middle ... (just kidding *grin*) ... ... I would like to discuss not only early Christianity (Orthodox, Gnostic and Essene and the lost books of the bible) -- the original teachings, plus the actual history of Christianity (hidden agendas and all ...including the Inquistion and the Crusades etc), but also all of the channeled Christian books too. Edgar Cayce, Seth, the Michael teachings ...   [retrieve this message]
  • while we're on the topic of music....   daizy4   10y
     
    ... from Jesus Christ Superstar..... ... ... Mary Magdalene: ... ... Try not to get worried ... Try not to turn on to ... Problems that upset you ... oh Don’t you know ... Everything’s alright ... Yes everything’s fine ... And we want you to sleep well tonight ... Let the world turn without you tonight ... If we try ... We’ll get by ... So forget all about us tonight ... ... Apostles’ Women: ... Everything’s all right ... Yes everything’s all right yes ... ... Mary Magdalene: ... ... Sleep and I shall soothe you ... Calm you and anoint you ... Myrrh for your hot forehead ... oh Then you’ll feel ... Everything’s all right ... Yes everything’s fine ... And it’s cool and ...   [retrieve this message]
    • and a question about Mary Magdalene...   daizy4   10y
       
      ... is she the Holy Grail??? ... (as theorized in the DaVinci Code) ... ... I think so..... ...   [End]
      • Who was the bride at the beginning of Jesus’ ministry? Magd...   risingsun   10y
         
        Who was the bride at the beginning of Jesus’ ministry? Magdeline? ... ©†ƒ……•™¼‡_Original_Message_¾€š½ž¢«»¬ï°© ... ... Who was the bride at the beginning og Jesus’ ministry? Magdeline   [End]
        • ... Magdalen as the Bride of Christ ... ... Mary Magdalen ...   daizy4   10y
           
          ... Magdalen as the Bride of Christ ... ... Mary Magdalen was said to have been the Bride of Christ. Many of the Gnostic Gospels (revered early on in the Christian Church and later thrown out of the cannon) portray Mary Magdalen as Christ’s Most Beloved Disciple, reporting that Jesus often kissed her on the mouth and called her ”Woman Who Knows All.” Other disciples went to her for Christ’s teachings after he died (A). She is portrayed as sitting at Jesus’ feet to listen to his teachings (Luke 10:38-42) and also as anointing his feet with oil and drying them with her hair (John 11:2, 12:3). Three ...   [retrieve this message]
    • Re: while we're on the topic of music....   Blue Stone   10y
       
      One of my favorite movies/musicals of all time. Thanks Daisy. ... ... ... ”what’s the buzz tell me what’s a happenin”   [End]
  • Critique   Blue Stone   10y
     
    What The #$!* Do We Know as critiqued by a particular Christian media person. Comments welcome. ... ©†ƒ……•™¼‡_Original_Message_¾€š½ž¢«»¬ï°© ... ... What The #$!* Do We Know as critiqued by a particular Christian media person. Comments welcome. http://www.christianitytoday.com/movies/reviews/whatthedoweknow.html ...   [End]
  • Jesus Is Just Alright   Blue Stone   10y
     
    Jesus Is Just Alright ... The Doobie Brothers ... Music & Lyrics : A. Reynolds ... ... Doo doo doo doo doo doo doo doo ... Doo doo doo doo doo doo doo doo ... Doo doo doo doo doo doo doo doo ... Doo doo doo doo doo doo ... ... Jesus is just alright with me ... Jesus is just alright, oh yeah ... Jesus is just alright with me ... Jesus is just alright ... ... I don’t care what they may say ... I don’t care what they may do ... I don’t care what they may say ... Jesus is just alright, oh yeah ... Jesus is just alright ... ... Doo doo doo doo doo doo doo doo ... Doo doo doo doo doo doo doo doo ... Doo doo doo doo doo doo doo doo ... Doo doo doo doo doo doo ...   [retrieve this message]
    • Music heals: http://www.remo.com/health/index.cfm?ObjectID...   risingsun   10y
       
      Music heals: http://www.remo.com/health/index.cfm?ObjectID=71 ... ... Light, the universal substance of all life, manifests itself as color, sound, form and movement. Sound (music) is the rhythm, harmony and melody of the universe . . . the dance of life. The I ching (Chinese Book of Wisdom) declares that “Music has the power to ease tension within the heart, and to lessen and loosen obscure emotions. From time immemorial the inspiring effects to the invisible sound that moves all hearts and draws them together has mystified mankind.” ... ... http://curezone.com/forums/m.asp?f=3&i=502   [End]
    • Ah ha...   Wiz   10y
       
      Welcome to the nostalgic hippie forum (I knew there had to be some old hippie types lurking around)... ... ... ;0) ... ... Wiz   [End]
  • WOW!! very cool!   daizy4   10y
     
    thanks curezone for this forum! I am rarely able to spend time online these days and for the next weeks, but I was delighted to see this! It is indeed a shame that fragmentation had to occur, in that we now have two ”Christianity” forums, for I believe always in Oneness. ... ... I don’t have time to begin or join in any stimulating discussions at this time, but I’d like to share a blurb from one of my favorites..... http://www2.gol.com/users/coynerhm/teilhard.html ...   [End]
    • Well, we now we have a refuge over here. Perhaps we can tal...   Wiz   10y
       
      Well, we now we have a refuge over here. Perhaps we can talk about topics like Edgar Cayce and other channeled Christian teachings, plus all sorts of neat, esoteric stuff, demonic stuff... ... ... Oops.. sorry. I was demon yesterday on the other forum, and I forgot myself for a moment .... *wink* ... ... ;0) ... ... Wiz   [End]
    • for I believe always in Oneness for I believe always in One...   Eileen45   10y
       
      for I believe always in Oneness for I believe always in Oneness ... ... Just curious...why would you capitalize the word oneness? I didn’t think one would normally capitalize an adjective!? ... ...   [End]
      • Main Entry: one·ness ... Pronunciation: ’w&n-n&s ... Funct...   blueskyy   10y
         
        Main Entry: one·ness ... Pronunciation: ’w&n-n&s ... Function: noun ... : the quality or state or fact of being one: as a : SINGLENESS b : INTEGRITY, WHOLENESS c : HARMONY d : SAMENESS, IDENTITY e : UNITY, UNION ... ... ... I am perplexed by your post.   [End]
        • I am perplexed by the use of the term in the original post....   Eileen45   10y
           
          I am perplexed by the use of the term in the original post... ... is it being used to describe unity of a group of people with diverse beliefs - or as a theological position as in Oneness Theology. If it is the latter, (which is what I expect since the poster chose to capitalize the word) than the poster is stating a desire that everyone embrace their theology.   [End]
          • Daizy said ”for I believe always in Oneness”. I don’t under...   blueskyy   10y
             
            Daizy said ”for I believe always in Oneness”. I don’t understand how you extrapolate Daizy saying what she believes in to ”stating a desire that everyone embrace their theology”. Seems like a pretty big stretch to me. ... ©†ƒ……•™¼‡_Original_Message_¾€š½ž¢«»¬ï°© ... ... Daizy said ”for I believe always in Oneness”. I don’t understand how you extrapolate that in to ”stating a desire that everyone embrace their theology”.   [End]
            • Well, that is why I asked the question in the first place.....   Eileen45   10y
               
              Well, that is why I asked the question in the first place...so I wouldn’t have to ”extrapolate” - so I guess we will have to let her answer that question...if she will. ... ©†ƒ……•™¼‡_Original_Message_¾€š½ž¢«»¬ï°© ... ... Well, that is why I asked the question in the first place...so I why since it was her original post...if she will.   [End]
      • ... The reason for capitalizing Oneness is the same reason ...   daizy4   10y
         
        ... The reason for capitalizing Oneness is the same reason for capitalizing God.....Oneness....All That Is..... the unity of all things. In duality we appear separate but in reality we are all One; one soul, one body, one energy, one God, one being. ...   [End]
        • ... The reason for capitalizing Oneness is the same reason ...   Blue Stone   10y
           
          Are you saying we are all connected as in One? God is everything? ... ... How true. *wink*   [End]
          • yes...even quantum physics proves the interconnectedness!!   daizy4   10y
          • Re: WOW!! very cool!   Eileen45   10y
             
            But...that would make your belief Pantheistic instead of Monotheistic. How does that reconcile with Christianity? I am curious. Because God says that He alone is God and beside Him there is no other god(s).   [End]
            • WIth God being everything then we are just splitting hairs ...   Blue Stone   10y
               
              WIth God being everything then we are just splitting hairs with terminology. The illusion of seperateness is necessary for the experience we(God) have(has)chosen. The ”fragemented” selves are part of that illusion. ... ... Have you ever noticed that there is a dual nature of all things that resonates throughout ”creation”? Light and dark, good and evil, hot and cold, etc. What do you make of that? ...   [End]
              • Darkness - absence of light ... Evil - absence of good ... ...   Eileen45   10y
                 
                Darkness - absence of light ... Evil - absence of good ... Cold - absence of heat ... ... You get my drift...they aren’t opposites - you just get one when there is an absence of the other. ... ... And terminology is important when defining yourself, don’t you think? One would not want to be misrepresented. God himself says that He alone is God and beside Him there are no other gods. That is what makes Christianity a monotheistic religion and Oneness a Pantheistic religion.   [End]
                • What is the opposite of love then...   Wiz   10y
                   
                  I think you have missed the point of duality. So I ask, What is the opposite of love then? ... ... I will give you the benefit of the doubt, and perhaps you simply have a different understanding of it. ... ... You should know though, that our free will universe is the universe of duality. We have freedom of choice. To do or not do, to be or not to be etc. ... and all the principles of which we speak have their opposite, (which makes them whole) and integrating the opposites is one of the lessons of the physical plane... ... ... ;0) ... ... Wiz   [End]
                  • There is no opposite of LOVE - only the absence of it! To...   Eileen45   10y
                     
                    There is no opposite of LOVE - only the absence of it! To have an opposite implies an equal of some sort - and hate is no equal to love only the absence of it. ... ...   [End]
                    • Eileen/ a question please?   Dreamz   10y
                       
                      sincerely would like to understand this line of thinking... ... ... if you say that there are no opposites ,only absences.. ... then how can you rationalize that a person can be evil (bad) ... which would equal an absence of good... and have hate for others ... (an absense of love)... and yet love , and be caring for his own children or wife etc? ... ... even Jesus said this.. that the *wicked* also love their own... ... how can they be capable of love... ... ... if they have an absense of love? ... ... to me such words/ and facts of life bear out the proof that ... we do infact carry both aspects within us.. that they are ...   [retrieve this message]
                      • Dreamz...alot of good questions, alot of good points. ... H...   Eileen45   10y
                         
                        Dreamz...alot of good questions, alot of good points. ... However, I disagree with you. ... ... First of all, people are not categorically good or evil or some combination of both. Behavior is good or evil depending on our choices. And sometimes we choose to do the good and loving thing and other times, we choose to not do the good or loving thing. To choose to do the good and loving thing is to yield to the knowledge of God in each of us. To reject that knowledge is to harden our heart to God, in which case He then says that He gives us over to a reprobate mind. ... ... ”And even as they did n ...   [retrieve this message]
                    • The opposite of love is fear...   Wiz   10y
                       
                      ...because fear spawns all of the negative conditions... hatred and malice, jealousy and envy, and all the associated damaging and destructive emotional states. ... ... Love (which is the glue that binds the universe), spawns all of the positive states of being, compassion, tolerance and understanding. ... ... The interplay of the opposites is what we endeavor to integrate. By being constantly ’seduced’ by negative duality as young souls, we generally accrue bad Karma from life to life until we learn to BALANCE the energy. ... ... Once we begin to erase the strings of negative Karma that bind us to the ...   [retrieve this message]
                      • i AGREE with the statements below but the rest seem rather ...   prayerwarrior   10y
                         
                        i AGREE with the statements below but the rest seem rather convoluted: ... ... ... because fear spawns all of the negative conditions... hatred and malice, jealousy and envy, and all the associated damaging and destructive emotional states. ... ... Love (which is the glue that binds the universe), spawns all of the positive states of being, compassion, tolerance and understanding. ...   [End]
                        • I'm glad you found some of it agreeable... ;0)   Wiz   10y
                           
                          ...the rest is perfectly clear if you understand where it is coming from and how it applies to our lives. ... ... Some of the terms, like ’karma’ are eastern in original but the meaning is universal. The original teachings of Jesus contained much that was common with Buddhism and Hinduism, as he traveled through Persia, India and Tibet during his ’lost years’, before he began his ministry in Palestine. ... ... Unfortunately, most of those ideas were edited out of Christianity... ... ... ;0) ... ... Wiz ... ... ©†ƒ……•™¼‡_Original_Message_¾€š½ž¢«»¬ï°© ... ... ...the rest is perfectly clear if you understand where it is ...   [retrieve this message]
                      • Re: The opposite of love is fear...   Eileen45   10y
                         
                        Fear is the absence of God - as manifested by Satan and all of his principalities, powers, rulers of darkness and spiritual wickedness to those who do not know God. For the bible says that perfect LOVE casts out all fear. ... ... BTW, we need the negative and well as the positive, the creative as well as the destructive, the duality of the physical plane, and the freedom of choice, or we would have no environment in which to evolve and on our journey back to God...   [End]
                • Duality   Blue Stone   10y
                   
                  How would one go from warm to say warmer and then hot if there isn’t a scale with opposite ends(absolute lines)? ... ... Could you not, with your reasoning also say that, cold is the absence of heat, dark is the absence of light, and evil is the absence of good? ... ... The purpose of duality, (even the concepts of opposites or ”absences” as you put it) is to allow an experience of comparisons, distinctions, etc. What would ”good” be without having something to compare itself against? Where would the varying levels of light, etc come from if there was only a constant representation of light? ... ... In ...   [retrieve this message]
                  • ”The dual nature of our universe and moreover, consiousness...   Wiz   10y
                     
                    ”The dual nature of our universe and moreover, consiousness, comes about by having nothing and everything (alpha and omega) together, with our free will riding between like a cursor in the middle of a line of absolute choices” ... ... pretty deep, there friend.... ... ... ;0) ... ... Wiz   [End]
                  • Could you not, with your reasoning also say that, cold is t...   Eileen45   10y
                     
                    Could you not, with your reasoning also say that, cold is the absence of heat, dark is the absence of light, and evil is the absence of good? What would ”good” be without having something to compare itself against? Where would the varying levels of light, etc come from if there was only a constant representation of light? The dual nature of our universe and moreover, consiousness, comes about by having nothing and everything (alpha and omega) together, with our free will riding between like a cursor in the middle of a line of absolute choices. he dual nature of our universe and moreover, c ...   [retrieve this message]
                    • ”So…fear, darkness, evil etc. are gradually overcome by His...   Blue Stone   10y
                       
                      ”So…fear, darkness, evil etc. are gradually overcome by His love, light and goodness. Which makes fear, darkness, evil all the absence of God.” ... ... If God ”created” everything where did fear, darkness, and evil come from within your current understanding. ... ...   [End]
                      • Free Will   #2853   10y
                         
                        God created spiritual beings... & gave them free-will... The lesser god...thought himself greater than his creator...but how can the the creation be greater than the creator?   [End]
                        • ”God created spiritual beings... & gave them free-will... T...   Blue Stone   10y
                           
                          ”God created spiritual beings... & gave them free-will... The lesser god...thought himself greater than his creator...but how can the the creation be greater than the creator?” ... ... How about when they are one and the same. ... ... Btw, noone said anything about anyone being ”greater”. ... ... I am guessing you are taking your spiritual ”bearings” from The butchered Bible? ...   [End]
                  • Re: Duality   Eileen45   10y
                     
                    BTW, Blue Stone...would you mind explaining to me what *wink* means? I see it alot on this forum and it seems to have a particular meaning attached to it...but, maybe not?   [End]
              • God says?   Wiz   10y
                 
                Good points. ... ... However, Blue Stone, we might want to explore this ’God says’ statement of Eileen... ... ... Says where? to whom? in what language? what was he wearing? ... ... Every time someone intimates that God says something as if it is some kind of ultimate truth, I start to scratch my head, if you get my drift.... ... ... ;0) ... ... Wiz   [End]
                • Ye are my witnesses, saith the LORD, and my servant whom I ...   Eileen45   10y
                   
                  Ye are my witnesses, saith the LORD, and my servant whom I have chosen: that ye may know and believe me, and understand that I am he: before me there was no God formed, neither shall there be after me. Is 43:10 ... ... I have declared, and have saved, and I have shewed, when there was no strange god among you: therefore ye are my witnesses, saith the LORD, that I am God. Is 43:12 ... ... Thus saith the LORD the King of Israel, and his redeemer the LORD of hosts; I am the first, and I am the last; and beside me there is no God. Is 44:6 ... ... Fear ye not, neither be afraid: have not I told thee from t ...   [retrieve this message]
                  • Well, he saith it to you and not to me then...   Wiz   10y
                     
                    I do not believe God spoke ’to’ the biblical prophets. He may have spoken ’through’ them, but that is different. He speaks (and even acts) through poor little old me on rare occasions, when I manage to get out of ’myself’ and do something meaningful to aid and assist others in some small way and ask for nothing in return. ... ... He speaks thorough lots of people. However that is not the word of God. God is beyond mire words in the physical plane. However he manifests everywhere, in everything... ... ... ;0) ... ... Wiz   [End]
                    • I do not believe God spoke ’to’ the biblical prophets. He m...   Eileen45   10y
                       
                      I do not believe God spoke ’to’ the biblical prophets. He may have spoken ’through’ them, but that is different. I do not believe God spoke ’to’ the biblical prophets. He may have spoken ’through’ them, but that is different. ... ... God was speaking through the prophet Isaiah in describing Himself and even Jesus quoted the prophets. ... ... And yes, I agree that God still speaks to us and through us today. But, not to the extent that it contradicts - but rather harmonizes with His nature and will. ... ...   [End]
                      • Does God speak with a Texas drawl?   Wiz   10y
                         
                        God speaks and acts through every single human on the planet in some fashion, (even those who live miserable destructive lives, he speaks of what we should not do) ... ... But as to God speaking directly ’to’ us? Maybe with a Texas drawl? ... ... According to GW Bush, God told him to invade Iraq (which caused the deaths of 15,000 civilians, and over 1,000 Americans, and is a sore on the face of the earth that probably won’t heal for decades) ... ... If he is hearing voices that telling him to go murder people, he should be committed, not in charge of the most powerful military of the face of the earth. ...   [retrieve this message]
                        • That is precisely why we are ’to test the spirits’ to make ...   Eileen45   10y
                           
                          That is precisely why we are ’to test the spirits’ to make sure what we are hearing is truly from God as there are many gods trying to get their message through. What is the guiding principle or plumb line, if you will...for determining if those ”revelations” truly are from God or from some other source? Do we have an absolute from which to measure all actions? ... ... I certainly understand why you would have a problem with people that believe that God speaks to them personally when it seems to exempt that individual from personal choices and responsibility. Please understand Wiz, that f ...   [retrieve this message]
                          • I was about to post and apologize if I came off as a hard-a...   Wiz   10y
                             
                            I was about to post and apologize if I came off as a hard-ass in that last post. Your beliefs are as valid to you are mine are to me. However you replied before I could. ... ... You seem like a compassionate, loving person and after all, that is object lesson here on the earth plane. ... ... My language may have gotten a bit more edgy than usual the moment I mentioned Bush, who is an self righteous, sanctimonious individual with a ’dark age’ mentality. He has constructed a world of endless war and misery and FEAR, simply to profit the wealthy elite and multi-national corporations in this county. ... ...   [retrieve this message]
                            • Well...I thought you got a little ”edgy” there, but I under...   Eileen45   10y
                               
                              Well...I thought you got a little ”edgy” there, but I understand! I have a few edges of my own that can get caught on a principle and be somewhat harsh from time to time (I also have big feet and occassionaly step on a toe or two!) In case you haven’t noticed...my posts have already gotten quite a few 0’s on this forum and now you have a 0 for saying something nice about me! ... ... It doesn’t bother me though - I actually find it kind of funny! ... ... As for the political elite...have you noticed how extremely wealthy the people are who are currently involved in politics? Think about it...John ...   [retrieve this message]
                        • Until God speaks to you, I can understand your disbelief. G...   #2853   10y
                           
                          Until God speaks to you, I can understand your disbelief. God has spoken to me and it would be impossible to convince me otherwise. ... I don’t believe God ever told anyone to kill anyone but there are other voices out their speaking to us that could be mistaken for God. I have a lithmus test if one is hearing from God: ... ... #1 God is love: God is the same yesterday, today, & forever ... ... # 2 If someone hears from God and it agrees with # 1 then one has heard from God ... ... #3 If someone hears from what they believe is God and it does agree with #1 & #2 then go to #1 ... ... God is the same yesterday, ...   [retrieve this message]
            • Eileen, regarding Oneness....   daizy4   10y
               
              ... I just read this from your post on the Christianity Support forum... hmmm...it sure looks like Oneness reconciles with Christianity to me... as I read it back to you.... ... ... your post: ... ... ”I do not pray for these alone, but also for those who will believe in Me through their word; that they all may be ONE, as You, Father, are in Me, and I in You; that they also may be ONE in us, that the world may believe that You sent Me. And the glory which You gave Me I have given them, that they may be ONE just as We are ONE: I in them, and You in Me; that they may be made perfect in ONE, and that the ...   [retrieve this message]
              • I don’t think One was capitalized was it? ... ... Anyway...   Eileen45   10y
                 
                I don’t think One was capitalized was it? ... ... Anyway, I agree that God’s desire is that His ’children’ be one (in unity). It does not state that He desires (or expect) that ’all of creation’ including all plant, animal and mineral world be one. Read the post again...”I do not pray for the world but for those whom You have given Me, for they are Yours.”   [End]
        • Re: WOW!! very cool!   Eileen45   10y
           
          The reason for capitalizing Oneness is the same reason for capitalizing God The reason for capitalizing Oneness is the same reason for capitalizing God ... ... I capitalize God because it designates his uniqueness among other gods...and His deity!   [End]
  • If there are errors then what is true? God is love...   #3922   10y
     
    What The Christian Fundamentalist Doesn’t Want You To Know ... A Brief Survey of Biblical Errancy ... An essay in hypertext by Scott Bidstrup ... ... ”Believing is easier than thinking. Hence so many more believers than thinkers.” --Bruce Calvert ... ... ... ... ... One of the bedrock beliefs of most Christian fundamentalists is in the inerrancy of their scripture, the Bible. Indeed, if it can be shown that the English-language Bible that I can obtain at my local bookseller (usually the defined as the King James Version) is absolutely inerrant, their case that it is the word of God would be greatly strengthened ...   [retrieve this message]
    • Thank you for the information! ... ... This is why I thin...   blueskyy   10y
       
      Thank you for the information! ... ... This is why I think it is important to: ... ... 1. Trust your heart and inner guidance (i.e. personal relationship with God) to guide you to the truth ... ... 2. Not waste time bickering over details, but focus on the overall message of love, peace, and personal growth (i.e. do not point out the sawdust in another’s eye until you have dealt with the log in your own)   [End]
      • Thank you for the information! ... ... This is why I thin...   Blue Stone   10y
         
        Thank you for the information! ... ... This is why I think it is important to: ... ... 1. Trust your heart and inner guidance (i.e. personal relationship with God) to guide you to the truth ... ... 2. Not waste time bickering over details, but focus on the overall message of love, peace, and personal growth (i.e. do not point out the sawdust in another’s eye until you have dealt with the log in your own)   [End]
        • The math is wrong but God is still love...   #3922   10y
           
          Before I found the first error in the Bible, quite by accident, ... I was under the mistaken impression that the Bible was free of error. Now my perception has changed and only one thing is clear. ”God is love.” If any man, spirit, or even an angel from heaven would tell me anything but God is love then I might smile and say a prayer because I would never go anywhere but here... meaning into the arms of a loving God but then If one wants to wander around in the land of fear....please don’t try to take me there...because right here beside Aba Father God is where I belong... I am safe riught h ...   [retrieve this message]
  • Now This Is A Forum...   Blue Stone   10y
     
    ..that makes alot of sense. The name suggests openness, willing ness to explore possibilities centering on Jesus, not just the usual hand me down version of him passed down through the ages by totalitarian states. This should help quash the elitist metality seen in the ”other” forum with a similar name. Open to explore at last. This forum should see many a great discussion and without the usual roadblocks placed up due to not being comfortable thinking outside a manmade, fear crafted box.   [End]
  • Why were the books of the Apocrypha taken out?   #30325   10y
     
    Did the church fathers quote Apocrypha’s books these as Scripture? I found the Apocrypha in my family Bible and believe it is possible that these books have been suppressed for some reason. ... ... Ans: Very much so, yes. Before 315 A.D. I found them quoting from all of the Apocrypha’s books ”as Scripture” over 352 times. This can be verified by checking Volume 10 of the Ante-Nicene Fathers Scripture Reference Index, where almost every verse quoted by the early Church is referenced. ... ... ... ... Roger wrote: ... ... I know they tend to be view(ed) more as non inspired historical books, but of good value f ...   [retrieve this message]
  • Congratulations and Forum Description!!!   R moderator butterfly   10y
     
    All right folks, we need a description for this forum. Daizy4 has worked something up. It is posted below. (Daizy, I hope you don’t mind that I copied and moved it over here) If anyone else would like to contribute in a constructive   [End]
    • Daizy's description copied from Suggestions to Webamster fo...   R daizy4   10y
       
      Here it goes...I put this together quickly, so I’m glad to hear it can be edited: ... ... The reason for a Progressive Christianity Discussion Forum: ... Many of us are unable to have discussions or debate on the Christianity forums, even though many of us are Christian. If our view is different, we are called ”heathens, heretics, apostates, lost souls, demons, and in one case ”swine.” We are asked to go to the other religion forums, but when we do, THEY FOLLOW US THERE!!! and barge in on our discussions with proselytising, judgements, and cut and paste quotes from the bible. If they do not l ...   [retrieve this message]
      • Jesus was a liberal?   Wiz   10y
         
        The conservative Christians won’t like that! But, hey, if the conservatives can have their brand of Chrsitianity, why not the liberals. (I’m not a liberal, but I don’t much care about the labels) ... ... Actually, I had thought an alternative Christian forum was a good idea. I might have called it the ’enlightened Christianity’ forum though. ... ... Now THAT is a pretty spiffy name. ... ... ;0) ... ... Wiz ...   [End]
        • Hey Wiz!! ... ... I agree with you about the ”liberal” lab...   daizy4   10y
           
          Hey Wiz!! ... ... I agree with you about the ”liberal” label, or any label for that matter.... ... ... And hey, I’m not married to ”progressive” in the description....”enlightened” sounds good to me as well or even better....I just used the word ”progressive”, because many communities use it as well. ... ...   [End]
          • Progressive is fine.   Wiz   10y
             
            We didn’t use alternative, and that is probably good or we might sound like a bunch of old hippies sitting around b-i-t-c-hing ... ... ... ;0) ... ... Wiz ... ©†ƒ……•™¼‡_Original_Message_¾€š½ž¢«»¬ï°© ... ... We didn’t use alternative, and that is probaly good or we might sound like bunch of old hippies sitting around *%#&¤?§*ing ... ... ... ;0) ... ... Wiz   [End]
            • ah, I CAN post here but won’t stay! I don’t think Jesus wa...   PBC   10y
               
              ah, I CAN post here but won’t stay! I don’t think Jesus was liberal or progressive when I view Him as immutable...changes not! :-) We change to either move closer or further away from Him.   [End]
              • Well, that is why I asked the question in the first place.....   Wiz   10y
                 
                To each his (or her) own. ... ... I don’t happen to believe Jesus was a liberal either. He was an anarchist. ... ... ;0) ... ... Wiz   [End]
                • so true...   daizy4   10y
                   
                  ... ...anarchist is more accurate.....please feel free Wiz to adjust the forum description, as the moderator invited all to do so. I put that together in a hurry and it needs some tweaking... ... ... The ”Jesus was a Liberal” thing was found on a website....just for fun..   [End]
  • These Christians are now called gnostics, from the Greek wo...   blueskyy   10y
     
    From The Gnostic Gospels ... by Elaine Pagels ... ... In December 1945 an Arab peasant made an astonishing archeological discovery in Upper Egypt. Rumors obscured the circumstances of this find--perhaps because the discovery was accidental, and its sale on the black market illegal. For years even the identity of the discoverer remained unknown. One rumor held that he was a blood avenger; another, that he had made the find near the town of Naj ’Hammádì at the Jabal al-Tárif, a mountain honeycombed with more than 150 caves. Originally natural, some of these caves were cut and painted and used as gra ...   [retrieve this message]
    • a summary   blueskyy   10y
       
      Since that is such a long article, I pulled these four paragraphs out to emphasize them, as they are the most relevant in my opinion. ... What do you all think? ... ... ... ”Orthodox Jews and Christians insist that a chasm separates humanity from Its creator: God is wholly other. But some of the gnostics who wrote these gospels contradict this: self-knowledge is knowledge of God; the self and the divine are identical. ... ... Second, the ”living Jesus” of these texts speaks of illusion and enlightenment, not of sin and repentance, like the Jesus of the New Testament. Instead of coming to save us from si ...   [retrieve this message]
    • Re: These Christians are now called gnostics, from the Gree...   #68716   10y
       
      Very interesting indeed. ... ... yet this part in the very beginning: ... ”hacked off his limbs . . . ripped out his heart, and devoured it among them, as the ultimate act of blood revenge.” ... ... Well alrighty then! They just have to say that! lol ... Do you know the time frame? Pre Islam was harsh, nomadic tribes strayed from the path of the Abrahamic faith, that is why Prophet M’hamad came to that area and purified it with His ( Gods guidance and grace) Light, the same Light He ( God) gave sweet Jesus, may Peace be upon them both. ... ... Anyways didnt mean to intrude into your forum guys, but wanted to ...   [retrieve this message]
      • 1945 is when the texts were rediscovered...but please don’t...   blueskyy   10y
         
        1945 is when the texts were rediscovered...but please don’t take that post as an effort to bash Muslims. That definitely wasn’t my intention! I don’t think the article mentions what the religion of the men who discovered the text was. ... ... You are not intruding.   [End]
        • Thanks, I have read parts of the Nag Hammadi documents and ...   #68716   10y
           
          Thanks, I have read parts of the Nag Hammadi documents and do find them very interesting. ... But this bedouin arab man, it went into great detail and disgusting way to revenge his fathers murder, that only preIslamic times were they happening, after Islam it was clearly forbidden to do so! ... Just wanted to clarify that- ;) ... ... Thanks again for the dialogue-   [End]
          • I think this forum would be an interesting place to talk ab...   #30325   10y
             
            I think this forum would be an interesting place to talk about the comonailities of Yehshua of the Torah and the Yehshua of the Koran? ... ©†ƒ……•™¼‡_Original_Message_¾€š½ž¢«»¬ï°© ... ... I think this forum would be an interesting place to talk about the comonailities of Yehshua of the Torah and the Yehshua of the Koran?   [End]

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Challenge the message and not the messenger!
The first person to resort to name calling and personal attacks automatically loses the debate!
Personal attack is often the best indication that the writer knows his logic is flawed and therefore tries to deflect attention by attacking the opponent, instead of attacking the arguments of the opponent.

 

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"Be not too fond of argument. Rather suggest what remarks may have occurred to you on a subject than aim at dictating your opinions to others or at defending yourself on all points. You will learn more by agreeing in the main with others and entering into trains of thinking, than by contradicting and urging them to extremities."
~ William Hazlitt

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